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      05-15-2014, 09:36 PM   #1
mr-karim
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Talking f13 M6 vs Ferrari FF & E63 AMG 4matic (tuned)

Very proud of M6
Nice to see races like that



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      05-16-2014, 08:53 PM   #2
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      05-16-2014, 09:55 PM   #3
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PP-Performance M6 is a beast There is a video of it on dragtimes on youtube it can keep up with a stock Aventador
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      05-16-2014, 10:25 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YungDro View Post
PP-Performance M6 is a beast There is a video of it on dragtimes on youtube it can keep up with a stock Aventador
Yes, too bad we don't have PP-Performance here in Canada, probably the best tuner out there.
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      05-17-2014, 07:31 PM   #5
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damn that M6 is ridiculous.
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      05-17-2014, 07:42 PM   #6
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Not surprise to see M6 beats E63 at rolling since this is the advantage of RWD over AWD. Even stock M5 can beat stock E63 AMG S 4 matic at higher speed while racing from standstill where AWD can take the advantage.

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      05-17-2014, 08:23 PM   #7
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Good lord.. however FF is one of my favourite cars on the road! Real special..
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      05-19-2014, 12:17 PM   #8
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Do you have a clean run v the benz. BMW jumped 1st race and there was a truck in the Benz's lane on the 2nd run.

Sweet vids!!!
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      05-21-2014, 11:45 AM   #9
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heres a clean run... the M6 spanks the E63 AMG 4Matic.



This M6 can keep up with an aventador
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      05-22-2014, 07:39 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YungDro
heres a clean run... the M6 spanks the E63 AMG 4Matic.



This M6 can keep up with an aventador
Umm no it can't lol . Aventadors run mid 10's at 133-134mph traps in the 1/4 mile . Tuned M6's are very fast , I have one, but lets not get carried away .
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      05-22-2014, 08:22 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
Umm no it can't lol . Aventadors run mid 10's at 133-134mph traps in the 1/4 mile . Tuned M6's are very fast , I have one, but lets not get carried away .
But I saw this one video where an M6 beat an aventador....

Reaction time, 60'ft time, variations in traction, bad driver etc etc etc couldn't possibly have anything to do with it.
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      05-22-2014, 09:55 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
Umm no it can't lol . Aventadors run mid 10's at 133-134mph traps in the 1/4 mile . Tuned M6's are very fast , I have one, but lets not get carried away .
I disagree! I mean you cannot simply claim that this particular M6 cannot keep up with Aventador in rolling (all videos posted are referring to rolling not drag racing) since you do not have any written or measured data.
The other day you posted in another thread a report comparing R8, M6 CP, GTR and 911TTS. according to that report, M6 CP can run 100-200 km/h in 7.3 second which is almost the subject of 60-130 mph. considering %15 underrated, M6 CP has about 660HP and it's still almost %10-15 less power than this M6. As you know there are so many factors define the result of Rolling race. The most 4 factors are power, weight, air resistance and type of drivetrain (FED,RWD,AWD). now comparing the Aventador with this M6, Aventador is lighter and probably less air resistance, but less power and also AWD which is disadvantage here (we are not talking about drag where the AWD is a big advantage). I don't claim this particular M6 can keep up with Aventador. Maybe or maybe not, but I guess the numbers will be so close.
BTW, does your modded M6 generate the same power????
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      05-22-2014, 01:50 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M6-Coupe View Post
I disagree! I mean you cannot simply claim that this particular M6 cannot keep up with Aventador in rolling (all videos posted are referring to rolling not drag racing) since you do not have any written or measured data.
The other day you posted in another thread a report comparing R8, M6 CP, GTR and 911TTS. according to that report, M6 CP can run 100-200 km/h in 7.3 second which is almost the subject of 60-130 mph. considering %15 underrated, M6 CP has about 660HP and it's still almost %10-15 less power than this M6. As you know there are so many factors define the result of Rolling race. The most 4 factors are power, weight, air resistance and type of drivetrain (FED,RWD,AWD). now comparing the Aventador with this M6, Aventador is lighter and probably less air resistance, but less power and also AWD which is disadvantage here (we are not talking about drag where the AWD is a big advantage). I don't claim this particular M6 can keep up with Aventador. Maybe or maybe not, but I guess the numbers will be so close.
BTW, does your modded M6 generate the same power????
The problem is the Aventador has a legit 700 hp engine , aggressive gearing , and WAYYYYYYY better aero all while weighing in at 37xx pounds . There are multiple instrumented tests of the Aventador running 10.x and 133-34 real trap speed not GPS. It is in the 5.8-6 flat range 100-200km/hr too. Its a real deal super car. I have SS DP's , Gruppe M intake and full Akrapovic exhaust with a piggyback on top of my CP ECU. I'd bet my car is within 30 hp of any PP variant based on my own acc numbers as I have hit 129mph GPS in the 1/4 in non ideal +1300 density altitude conditions and run a mid 7 60-130 mph. FYI you can not extrapolate a 60-130 from a 100-200km/hr (62-124), as they are quite different. Every mph over 120 takes considerably longer, and the difference between the two numbers can be over a second .
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      05-22-2014, 02:17 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M6-Coupe View Post
I disagree! I mean you cannot simply claim that this particular M6 cannot keep up with Aventador in rolling (all videos posted are referring to rolling not drag racing) since you do not have any written or measured data.
The other day you posted in another thread a report comparing R8, M6 CP, GTR and 911TTS. according to that report, M6 CP can run 100-200 km/h in 7.3 second which is almost the subject of 60-130 mph. considering %15 underrated, M6 CP has about 660HP and it's still almost %10-15 less power than this M6. As you know there are so many factors define the result of Rolling race. The most 4 factors are power, weight, air resistance and type of drivetrain (FED,RWD,AWD). now comparing the Aventador with this M6, Aventador is lighter and probably less air resistance, but less power and also AWD which is disadvantage here (we are not talking about drag where the AWD is a big advantage). I don't claim this particular M6 can keep up with Aventador. Maybe or maybe not, but I guess the numbers will be so close.
BTW, does your modded M6 generate the same power????
An FBO M6 in my region trapped 127 (intake, full exhaust, tune, gas, tires)

The fastest M5 documented on the forum trapped 128 (at a kind track) with tune, exhaust, tires.

Those are the peaks… Other tuned cars have trapped less. There is an F10 on dragtimes PP-tuned that trapped 124.

Unless this M6 is much faster than the fastest documented M5 and M6.... then it's slower than an aventador.

The most likely explanation is probably true, the M6 in these vids likely traps 128 at most.... ie slower than an aventador.

I'm sure you know that trap speed correlates well with roll race performance.

Last edited by turbo8765; 05-22-2014 at 03:25 PM.. Reason: spelling
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      05-22-2014, 04:28 PM   #15
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I think everyone is getting carried away with the lambo. You are comparing a £280k car against a £80k car . It's like comparing a Boeing 747 with a F22. The M6 is a grand tourer, with comfort, power and style . The GTR and lambo are all about , look at me , I challenge you to a race .... The moral of the story is , I am saving up for a lambo !!!!....lol
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      05-22-2014, 04:45 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michel lane View Post
I think everyone is getting carried away with the lambo. You are comparing a £280k car against a £80k car . It's like comparing a Boeing 747 with a F22. The M6 is a grand tourer, with comfort, power and style . The GTR and lambo are all about , look at me , I challenge you to a race .... The moral of the story is , I am saving up for a lambo !!!!....lol
we are not comparing two cars! and we are not expecting the same performance! the only curiosity is if the moded 740HP M6 can keep up with Aventador in rolling
it's like you want to see if Aventador can beat Nissan GTR in drag race. are they the same class? are they the same price? no they are not but both of them are named as one of the fastest car in 0-60... that's all
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      05-22-2014, 05:13 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turbo8765 View Post

I'm sure you know that trap speed correlates well with roll race performance.
Not exactly!
First of all do you have the trap speed for this particular M6 with 740 HP?
Second, let me re-post the reports "gmd2003" posted the other day.
Look at the results and compare R8 with M6. R8 can reach 0-50 km/h in 1.6 second and then 0-100 km/h in 3.5 second. It means this car needs 1.9 second to go from 50 km/h to 100 km/h. M6 needs 1.9 second to go from 0 to 50 and 2 second to go from 50-100. It's telling me that R8 reaches 50 sooner because it's AWD while the acceleration curve is not the same in this two brackets. on the other hand M6 is having launch issue due to RWD and lose some times to get moved. again different acceleration curve. now let's put launch issue out of picture. R8 can go from 100 km/h to 250 km/h in 15.5 seconds the same as M6. it means at drag race R8 beats M6 but at rolling from 100 km/h to 250 km/h they are the same. another comparison is 0-200+ km/h that M6 beats R8 long way. so what I'm trying to say is that a RWD may beat an AWD in rolling and not in drag.
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      05-22-2014, 05:45 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
The problem is the Aventador has a legit 700 hp engine , aggressive gearing , and WAYYYYYYY better aero all while weighing in at 37xx pounds . There are multiple instrumented tests of the Aventador running 10.x and 133-34 real trap speed not GPS. It is in the 5.8-6 flat range 100-200km/hr too. Its a real deal super car. I have SS DP's , Gruppe M intake and full Akrapovic exhaust with a piggyback on top of my CP ECU. I'd bet my car is within 30 hp of any PP variant based on my own acc numbers as I have hit 129mph GPS in the 1/4 in non ideal +1300 density altitude conditions and run a mid 7 60-130 mph. FYI you can not extrapolate a 60-130 from a 100-200km/hr (62-124), as they are quite different. Every mph over 120 takes considerably longer, and the difference between the two numbers can be over a second .
I did not extrapolate 60-130 from a 100-200km/h did I? "I said subject to"..... I just wanted to give you an example to see how fast a 660 HP car can catch that numbers and for the same car with %10-15 more power we expect much better number (I don't say %10-15 more)
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      05-22-2014, 06:36 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michel lane View Post
I think everyone is getting carried away with the lambo. You are comparing a £280k car against a £80k car . It's like comparing a Boeing 747 with a F22. The M6 is a grand tourer, with comfort, power and style . The GTR and lambo are all about , look at me , I challenge you to a race .... The moral of the story is , I am saving up for a lambo !!!!....lol
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
Umm no it can't lol . Aventadors run mid 10's at 133-134mph traps in the 1/4 mile . Tuned M6's are very fast , I have one, but lets not get carried away .
um yes it can. do you both have a PP performance M6? No. and the current stage of the M6 in this video was only stage 2 with 680bhp.. right now its pumping 720+ meaning its even faster..



theres the video and the proof. if that was in the real world meaning at a set of traffic lights it would keep up with it...

and +1 to everything that M6-Coupe said!

Last edited by YungDro; 05-22-2014 at 06:42 PM.. Reason: To prove to Michel Lane and gmd2003 the M6 is a luxury beast that can keep up with an aventador..
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      05-22-2014, 06:57 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M6-Coupe View Post
Not exactly!
First of all do you have the trap speed for this particular M6 with 740 HP?
First off, I doubt the 740hp quote.

Assuming 12% DT loss that would be 650whp. That would have to be 650whp SAE (not the higher reading STD) correction factor and repeatable. To be fair it should also be on an unbiased 3rd party dyno. Preferrably one that other known cars were dyno'ed on to have a reference point.

I read about a lot of different cars on a lot of different forum. We all know there are a lot of high reading dynos. Especially vendor owned dyno's. I'm not going to name names, but if you read very much you already know of some examples.

I'm not trying to call you out, I'm just trying to keep us all honest. I'd be the first to congratulate anyone with a repeatable, SAE corrected, 650whp from a known realistic dyno.

Second, re-read my post. Of course I don't know the trap speed for this particular M6. It is unlikely, however, that this car traps 5mph faster than the two fastest documented trap speeds on this forum. HIGHLY unlikely. It's more likely that it's trap speeds are very similar to other cars with similar mods. Cars with similar mods seem to be trapping 125-128 (admittedly the number of data points remain low)…. but 133 would put this car WAY off the bell curve.

Finally… perform 100 roll races with different cars with known trap speeds. Barring irregularities including but not limited to wheel spin, incorrect initial gear, missed shift, or bouncing off the limiter… the car that traps higher will win the vast majority of the time. Not every time but the lion share. Trap speed is the single best indicator of performance in a roll race beginning at typical speeds i.e. 30-70mph.
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      05-22-2014, 06:58 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
The problem is the Aventador has a legit 700 hp engine , aggressive gearing , and WAYYYYYYY better aero all while weighing in at 37xx pounds . There are multiple instrumented tests of the Aventador running 10.x and 133-34 real trap speed not GPS. It is in the 5.8-6 flat range 100-200km/hr too. Its a real deal super car. I have SS DP's , Gruppe M intake and full Akrapovic exhaust with a piggyback on top of my CP ECU. I'd bet my car is within 30 hp of any PP variant based on my own acc numbers as I have hit 129mph GPS in the 1/4 in non ideal +1300 density altitude conditions and run a mid 7 60-130 mph. FYI you can not extrapolate a 60-130 from a 100-200km/hr (62-124), as they are quite different. Every mph over 120 takes considerably longer, and the difference between the two numbers can be over a second .
What piggy back do you have? BMS?
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      05-22-2014, 07:00 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turbo8765 View Post
First off, I doubt the 740hp quote.

Assuming 12% DT loss that would be 650whp. That would have to be 650whp SAE (not the higher reading STD) correction factor and repeatable. To be fair it should also be on an unbiased 3rd party dyno. Preferrably one that other known cars were dyno'ed on to have a reference point.

I read about a lot of different cars on a lot of different forum. We all know there are a lot of high reading dynos. Especially vendor owned dyno's. I'm not going to name names, but if you read very much you already know of some examples.

I'm not trying to call you out, I'm just trying to keep us all honest. I'd be the first to congratulate anyone with a repeatable, SAE corrected, 650whp from a known realistic dyno.

Second, re-read my post. Of course I don't know the trap speed for this particular M6. It is unlikely, however, that this car traps 5mph faster than the two fastest documented trap speeds on this forum. HIGHLY unlikely. It's more likely that it's trap speeds are very similar to other cars with similar mods. Cars with similar mods seem to be trapping 125-128 (admittedly the number of data points remain low)…. but 133 would put this car WAY off the bell curve.

Finally… perform 100 roll races with different cars with known trap speeds. Barring irregularities including but not limited to wheel spin, incorrect initial gear, missed shift, or bouncing off the limiter… the car that traps higher will win the vast majority of the time. Not every time but the lion share. Trap speed is the single best indicator of performance in a roll race beginning at typical speeds i.e. 30-70mph.
AMS is working on a turbo upgrade for M5/M6 engines, should give about 95hp crank
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