BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
Go Back   6Post.com | BMW 6-Series Forum > BMW 6 Series Forum > BMW M6 Forum (F12 / F13)

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      03-11-2020, 12:34 PM   #1
plm
Private
United_States
33
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: M6 GC
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: SoCal

iTrader: (0)

Current BMW oil grade

It seems that the BMW oil supplier has changed over time, so does anybody know what the current grade being used by BMW for the S63 engine is?

Bonus question: does anyone know the full capacity for the M6 for an oil change?
Appreciate 0
      03-11-2020, 01:11 PM   #2
Flying Ace
Lieutenant General
Flying Ace's Avatar
United_States
4012
Rep
10,699
Posts

Drives: M6GC ZCP, X5d
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: SF, CA

iTrader: (5)

The dealership/OEM oil is provided by Pennzoil/Shell. It comes in 2 known grades in the US 0-30 and 5-30. When you buy it, make sure you receive the LL-01 or LL-01 FE spec. The front label should have the word "Gasoline" under "Twin Power Turbo". For suburban and highway driving, I recommend 0-30. If you're constantly revving the motor, then go with 5-30. In all cases, do not rev over 3000 rpms until oil temp is around 200 degrees. You'll need 10 bottles. 9.5 is the capacity for pan and filter housing.

Confusingly, the OEM diesel oils, has similar bottles and grades but diesel is labeled with LL-04. Front lable says "Diesel" on it.

There exists at least one other LL-01 dealership oil, a 10-60 grade. That is not the correct oil, it is used for the last few generation NA I6, V8 and V10 M motors for M3/5/6 and Z8. That oil was barely sufficient for the S65/85 motors...but I digress.
__________________
12 AW/Cinnamon X5 Diesel Urban Assault Vehicle
14 AW M6GC ZCP, MPE, V2 steering wheel, vorsteiner spoiler
08 SSII E90 M3 (Sold!)

Last edited by Flying Ace; 03-12-2020 at 06:05 PM..
Appreciate 1
samp270.00

      03-11-2020, 01:54 PM   #3
arucano
First Lieutenant
arucano's Avatar
United_States
104
Rep
317
Posts

Drives: 2014 M6 Grand Coupe CP
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Kingwood TX

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2014 BMW M6 GC  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Ace View Post
The dealership/OEM oil is provided by Pennzoil/Shell. It comes in 2 known grades in the US 0-30 and 5-30. When you buy it, make sure you receive the LL-01 or LL-01 FE spec. The front label should have the word "Gasoline" under "Twin Power Turbo". For suburban and highway driving, I recommend 0-30. If you're constantly revving the motor, then go with 5-30.
.
the 0 -30 is better for cold climate startup. the 5-30 can be used in warmer climates. At running temperature, both grades act the same.
__________________
F06 M6 Grand Coupe CP - 'E39 530I 5sp
Sapphire Black Metallic/Black - Black/Black
The drive is the destination
Appreciate 2
Flying Ace4012.00
BMWM5NYC432.50

      03-11-2020, 02:00 PM   #4
plm
Private
United_States
33
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: M6 GC
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: SoCal

iTrader: (0)

Thanks guys. So I guess it's safe to assume that it has a 30 grade oil in it, which would also explain some oil consumption between services.
Appreciate 0
      03-11-2020, 03:37 PM   #5
Whipple
Lieutenant
Whipple's Avatar
163
Rep
471
Posts

Drives: 2015 BMW M6 Gran Coupe
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: New York

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Ace View Post
The dealership/OEM oil is provided by Pennzoil/Shell. It comes in 2 known grades in the US 0-30 and 5-30. When you buy it, make sure you receive the LL-01 or LL-01 FE spec. The front label should have the word "Gasoline" under "Twin Power Turbo". For suburban and highway driving, I recommend 0-30. If you're constantly revving the motor, then go with 5-30. In all cases, do not rev over 3000 rpms until oil temp is around 200 degrees. You'll need 9 bottles. 8.5 is the capacity for pan and filter housing.

Confusingly, the OEM diesel oils, has similar bottles and grades but diesel is labeled with LL-04. Front lable says "Diesel" on it.

There exists at least one other LL-01 dealership oil, a 10-60 grade. That is not the correct oil, it is used for the last few generation NA I6, V8 and V10 M motors for M3/5/6 and Z8. That oil was barely sufficient for the S65/85 motors...but I digress.
Is there a menu to see the actual oil temp ? if so please tell me how to get there.
__________________
2015 M6 Gran Coupe> DME stage 3 tune>Fabworx Catless downpipes>Full Meistershaft GTC exhaust 102mm GB tips>RK Carbonfiber front mount intakes>
Vorsteiner front and rear Carbon diffuser>Auto Tecknic Cabon shift paddles>3D Design aluminum pedals
Appreciate 0
      03-11-2020, 08:44 PM   #6
plm
Private
United_States
33
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: M6 GC
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: SoCal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whipple View Post
Is there a menu to see the actual oil temp ? if so please tell me how to get there.
The right-hand gauge in the instrument cluster is oil temperature. Not the coolant temperature that you'd normally expect to see.
Appreciate 1
Whipple163.00

      03-11-2020, 09:38 PM   #7
Flying Ace
Lieutenant General
Flying Ace's Avatar
United_States
4012
Rep
10,699
Posts

Drives: M6GC ZCP, X5d
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: SF, CA

iTrader: (5)

I believe the first tic mark on the oil temp gauge is about 200 degrees
__________________
12 AW/Cinnamon X5 Diesel Urban Assault Vehicle
14 AW M6GC ZCP, MPE, V2 steering wheel, vorsteiner spoiler
08 SSII E90 M3 (Sold!)
Appreciate 0
      03-11-2020, 10:34 PM   #8
Whipple
Lieutenant
Whipple's Avatar
163
Rep
471
Posts

Drives: 2015 BMW M6 Gran Coupe
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: New York

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by plm View Post
The right-hand gauge in the instrument cluster is oil temperature. Not the coolant temperature that you'd normally expect to see.
Holy cow thats crazy I always wondered why it took so long for the car to get full temp thanks
__________________
2015 M6 Gran Coupe> DME stage 3 tune>Fabworx Catless downpipes>Full Meistershaft GTC exhaust 102mm GB tips>RK Carbonfiber front mount intakes>
Vorsteiner front and rear Carbon diffuser>Auto Tecknic Cabon shift paddles>3D Design aluminum pedals
Appreciate 0
      03-12-2020, 08:37 AM   #9
mikerx5
Lieutenant
mikerx5's Avatar
162
Rep
444
Posts

Drives: 2014 F06
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Providence, RI

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2013 BMW X6  [0.00]
Just got back from my local indy who did an oil change. Used 5w30 always and interestingly advises oil changes at 3-4k. Works on BMW and Porsche almost exclusively.

I was in there at 4k and he says oil looked good but thinks that should be the ceiling on intervals. I drive it 100 miles a week and it has never been tracked. He believes engine issues have a lot to do with late oil changes - just something to keep in mind!
Appreciate 0
      03-12-2020, 12:57 PM   #10
RagtagXMASTER
Second Lieutenant
RagtagXMASTER's Avatar
71
Rep
272
Posts

Drives: 2013 M6
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Boston MA

iTrader: (0)

this is true, also consider steeping up the viscosity too. there have been many failed engines from bearing wear, not as bad as the S65/85, but still present when driving the car. I run 5w-40 liqui moly molygen currently, and am considering going to redline 5w-50 for the next change.

Mikerx5 is completely correct in saying the oil change interval on these cars is too long from factory, 3-4 is the real interval with 4k being high. the oil is significantly burnt by that point.
__________________
Appreciate 0
      03-12-2020, 02:32 PM   #11
mikerx5
Lieutenant
mikerx5's Avatar
162
Rep
444
Posts

Drives: 2014 F06
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Providence, RI

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2013 BMW X6  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by RagtagXMASTER View Post
this is true, also consider steeping up the viscosity too. there have been many failed engines from bearing wear, not as bad as the S65/85, but still present when driving the car. I run 5w-40 liqui moly molygen currently, and am considering going to redline 5w-50 for the next change.

Mikerx5 is completely correct in saying the oil change interval on these cars is too long from factory, 3-4 is the real interval with 4k being high. the oil is significantly burnt by that point.
Do i need liquid moly? Seriously.

I have never even heard of it until getting an M. I outlined the way it is driven above, and my indy said he uses what BMW does... what does it do?
Appreciate 0
      03-12-2020, 03:32 PM   #12
Qsilver7
Colonel
Qsilver7's Avatar
United_States
1279
Rep
2,573
Posts

Drives: F06 650ix GC / F15 X5 50i
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Indiana, USA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whipple View Post
Is there a menu to see the actual oil temp ? if so please tell me how to get there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by plm View Post
The right-hand gauge in the instrument cluster is oil temperature. Not the coolant temperature that you'd normally expect to see.
Ditto PLM. BMW did a switcheroo from past generations and changed the coolant temp gauge to an oil temp gauge. But I think they've started going back to a coolant temp gauge on some of the new G series. So it's best to pay attention to the little icon...if its an oil tin w/thermometer sticking out vs squiggly lines (representing water) w/thermometer sticking out.
Attached Images
  
__________________
2014 F15 X5 50i MSport | 2013 F06 650ix Gran Coupe`
BMW CCA Member #191509
Appreciate 0
      03-12-2020, 03:45 PM   #13
Qsilver7
Colonel
Qsilver7's Avatar
United_States
1279
Rep
2,573
Posts

Drives: F06 650ix GC / F15 X5 50i
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Indiana, USA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by plm View Post
Bonus question: does anyone know the full capacity for the M6 for an oil change?
Based on the chart from the TIS website it looks like 9.5 liters (if you need help to convert to quarts...google for a converter). The S63TU probably uses the same amount of oil regardless if it is in the F10 or the F06/F12/F13...because its the same for the other V8 engines (N63TU & N63):
Attached Images
   
__________________
2014 F15 X5 50i MSport | 2013 F06 650ix Gran Coupe`
BMW CCA Member #191509
Appreciate 1
Flying Ace4012.00

      03-12-2020, 06:01 PM   #14
Flying Ace
Lieutenant General
Flying Ace's Avatar
United_States
4012
Rep
10,699
Posts

Drives: M6GC ZCP, X5d
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: SF, CA

iTrader: (5)

You correct, it's 9.5 bottles. An prepackaged change kit from ECS or FCP comes with 10 botlles. I'll change my post.
__________________
12 AW/Cinnamon X5 Diesel Urban Assault Vehicle
14 AW M6GC ZCP, MPE, V2 steering wheel, vorsteiner spoiler
08 SSII E90 M3 (Sold!)
Appreciate 0
      03-12-2020, 06:05 PM   #15
Flying Ace
Lieutenant General
Flying Ace's Avatar
United_States
4012
Rep
10,699
Posts

Drives: M6GC ZCP, X5d
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: SF, CA

iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikerx5 View Post
Just got back from my local indy who did an oil change. Used 5w30 always and interestingly advises oil changes at 3-4k. Works on BMW and Porsche almost exclusively.

I was in there at 4k and he says oil looked good but thinks that should be the ceiling on intervals. I drive it 100 miles a week and it has never been tracked. He believes engine issues have a lot to do with late oil changes - just something to keep in mind!

Sure, but, bearing clearance, type of oil, and warm up behavior is just as important.
__________________
12 AW/Cinnamon X5 Diesel Urban Assault Vehicle
14 AW M6GC ZCP, MPE, V2 steering wheel, vorsteiner spoiler
08 SSII E90 M3 (Sold!)
Appreciate 0
      03-12-2020, 06:24 PM   #16
plm
Private
United_States
33
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: M6 GC
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: SoCal

iTrader: (0)

I just ordered 2 5L bottles of the Motul SPECIFIC LL-01 FE 5W-30 to do an interim oil change between routine changes at the dealer, so that should be about perfect for a complete fill.

Side note, has anyone used the Motul? It seems there are next to no LL-01 FE oils available in the US, and BMW specifically state that LL-01 (non-FE) can only be used for topping up.

I like Liqui Moly in general, but don't want to risk any warranty issues by using something other than what BMW mandates.
Appreciate 0
      03-12-2020, 06:33 PM   #17
mikerx5
Lieutenant
mikerx5's Avatar
162
Rep
444
Posts

Drives: 2014 F06
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Providence, RI

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2013 BMW X6  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Ace View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikerx5 View Post
Just got back from my local indy who did an oil change. Used 5w30 always and interestingly advises oil changes at 3-4k. Works on BMW and Porsche almost exclusively.

I was in there at 4k and he says oil looked good but thinks that should be the ceiling on intervals. I drive it 100 miles a week and it has never been tracked. He believes engine issues have a lot to do with late oil changes - just something to keep in mind!

Sure, but, bearing clearance, type of oil, and warm up behavior is just as important.
Warm up behavior, dont move until completion of idle and keep it under 3500rpm until warm right?

What is bearing clearance?
Appreciate 0
      03-12-2020, 07:32 PM   #18
Qsilver7
Colonel
Qsilver7's Avatar
United_States
1279
Rep
2,573
Posts

Drives: F06 650ix GC / F15 X5 50i
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Indiana, USA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Ace View Post
You correct, it's 9.5 bottles. An prepackaged change kit from ECS or FCP comes with 10 botlles. I'll change my post.
If ECS & FCP are sending quarts in their kits...then that would be correct. I believe the conversion from 9.5 liters is equivalent to a little over 10 quarts. So you’re not incorrect if their kits is what’s familiar to you.
__________________
2014 F15 X5 50i MSport | 2013 F06 650ix Gran Coupe`
BMW CCA Member #191509
Appreciate 0
      03-12-2020, 10:15 PM   #19
Flying Ace
Lieutenant General
Flying Ace's Avatar
United_States
4012
Rep
10,699
Posts

Drives: M6GC ZCP, X5d
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: SF, CA

iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Qsilver7 View Post
If ECS & FCP are sending quarts in their kits...then that would be correct. I believe the conversion from 9.5 liters is equivalent to a little over 10 quarts. So you’re not incorrect if their kits is what’s familiar to you.
Thanks for giving me the out. Lol but no the companies are selling the standard liter bottles.

It's amazing this engine holds so much oil. The E90M3 I came from hell only 8.75. And that car had a front sump.
__________________
12 AW/Cinnamon X5 Diesel Urban Assault Vehicle
14 AW M6GC ZCP, MPE, V2 steering wheel, vorsteiner spoiler
08 SSII E90 M3 (Sold!)
Appreciate 0
      03-12-2020, 10:25 PM   #20
Flying Ace
Lieutenant General
Flying Ace's Avatar
United_States
4012
Rep
10,699
Posts

Drives: M6GC ZCP, X5d
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: SF, CA

iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikerx5 View Post
Warm up behavior, dont move until completion of idle and keep it under 3500rpm until warm right?

What is bearing clearance?
For warming up, I have been conditioned from the M3 ownership days to just keep it under 3000 RPMs until oil reaches clos to 200. Regarding idling, The quickest way to get the oil up the temperature is to actually drive the car. Idling the car causes strain on the cooling systems of the car because there's no air flow.

Bearing tolerance is not in your control. It's the overall design of the bearing and the amount of clearance that has to allow oil flow for lubrication. A theory of why the S65 and s85 motors all had premature bearing wear was that BMW designed it with very tight tolerances. And it was difficult to get a proper oil that provides good flow during the cold startup stage and also provide proper lubrication for the higher temperature requirements of a high revving engine. They designed the TWS 1060 oil, which was basically a compromised oil or high performance driving, but most of the owners were street driving the car anyways.

Many owners ended up using 0-40 for street cars. I'm not surprised that our M cars uses the same grade as non-M motors now.

I think if you're actually taking the car to a track, You're going to need a heavier grade oil. But warm up is even more important with those type of oils. One downside of using the current dealership oil is just the burn rate. Which in my opinion is acceptable given all the compromises the car has to have.

Just to give you an idea what I'm talking about, Google pictures or articles or videos of the oil used for formula 1 race motors. I heard that those oil had to be heated separately outside of the car and then injected into the motor right prior to starting up the car. Basically those oils are so much less viscous at low temperatures that it would damage the motor if it was actually started in the car.
__________________
12 AW/Cinnamon X5 Diesel Urban Assault Vehicle
14 AW M6GC ZCP, MPE, V2 steering wheel, vorsteiner spoiler
08 SSII E90 M3 (Sold!)

Last edited by Flying Ace; 03-12-2020 at 10:31 PM..
Appreciate 0
      03-13-2020, 10:04 AM   #21
RagtagXMASTER
Second Lieutenant
RagtagXMASTER's Avatar
71
Rep
272
Posts

Drives: 2013 M6
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Boston MA

iTrader: (0)

after getting some oil analysis back from blackstone on the oem oil, liqui moly liechlauf 5w-40, and molygen 5w-40, they all have a high failure rate at operating temperature in the s63tu, the notes on my oil reports are that the oil is thinning out at operating temp. the 30 weight acts more like a 20 weight at temp, and the 40 more like a 30 at temp

my next plan is to try out the redline 5w-50. its used in the DOHC mustangs. it has a really good sheer strength.

there are plenty of issues with the engines from a design aspect, but dont lose sleep over it.
__________________
Appreciate 1
Flying Ace4012.00

      03-13-2020, 10:42 AM   #22
Qsilver7
Colonel
Qsilver7's Avatar
United_States
1279
Rep
2,573
Posts

Drives: F06 650ix GC / F15 X5 50i
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Indiana, USA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikerx5 View Post
Warm up behavior, dont move until completion of idle and keep it under 3500rpm until warm right?
Ditto FlyingAce on this one, too. This has been a rather long debate/discussion over the decades...but all of my BMW owners manual going back to my 1985 e30 325e says the same thing...to drive right away on a cold engine instead of idling for long periods.

I idle long enough to get my seat belt on and then I'm off at a moderate driving style...paying attention to the engine and transmission. If it's really cold weather and the engine is revving high...I may give it a few seconds to settle down...but again that only takes usually less than 30 seconds.

From my f06 owners manual:
Attached Images
 
__________________
2014 F15 X5 50i MSport | 2013 F06 650ix Gran Coupe`
BMW CCA Member #191509

Last edited by Qsilver7; 03-13-2020 at 10:58 AM..
Appreciate 2
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:04 PM.




6post.com
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST