Steering knocking sound

[rorz12]

As you can hear from the video below, especially towards the end of the video, I have a strange knocking sound coming from the steering when I turn the steering left or right. If I get it in just the right position, the knocking sound stays until I move the steering again. I have a 2013 650i GC, about 61K miles.

I was at the dealership a few weeks ago and just from a quick inspection by the service advisor, he thought it's probably the steering rack/box. Which is a hefty bill...

Has anyone had this problem before? My mechanic said he used to own a 650i similar model and had the same problem but he sold it before ever fixing it. So I'm wondering if it's common.

Does anyone know if these models (with electric steering + active steering) have replacable/adjustable thrust pins in the steering rack like on older models and could it be that? Or is it maybe a steering column thing?

[suj999]

It could be my phone, but finding it hard to listen to the noise properly.

It could be the U joint (part number 32306790490 around £150) they can wear out. Had one replaced on a Mini recently which coincidently costs over £200 as its the full unit rather than just the bottom only on the 6er.

I take that as you have already checked that its not the track rods or ball joints?

[rorz12]

Originally Posted by suj999

It could be my phone, but finding it hard to listen to the noise properly.

It could be the U joint (part number 32306790490 around £150) they can wear out. Had one replaced on a Mini recently which coincidently costs over £200 as its the full unit rather than just the bottom only on the 6er.

I take that as you have already checked that its not the track rods or ball joints?

If you forward to 1:20 you can hear the knocking pretty clear. I had the ball joints checked pretty recently and they were okay. Tie rods as well. What were the symptoms on your mini for the bad U joint?

[suj999]

On the Mini I could feel it though the steering wheel, specially when one wheel was on a pavement (side walk?) And the other wasn't. Like the wheel was moving a tiny bit but the movement wasn't transferred to the steering wheel.

It did have a very slight knocking noise that you could hear when doing what you are doing above.

But on the Mini, for good measure I replaced the ball joints too

.

[rorz12]

Originally Posted by suj999

On the Mini I could feel it though the steering wheel, specially when one wheel was on a pavement (side walk?) And the other wasn't. Like the wheel was moving a tiny bit but the movement wasn't transferred to the steering wheel.

It did have a very slight knocking noise that you could hear when doing what you are doing above.

But on the Mini, for good measure I replaced the ball joints too

.

Thanks for that. I also have that feeling where I can shake the steering slightly and the car will still drive straight. Like its not 100% tight.

I believe the ball joints on my control arms are integrated, and you'd have to replace the whole arm once they wear out, but they were still okay last I remember..

Was there any test you performed to confirm the problem was from the steering column U joint? Or was it the dealership that told you?

I've been looking at the steering column components and apart from the U joint, there seems to also be what looks like a rubber bushing/guibo on the steering shaft. Similar to the ones on the driveshaft. See below images. Any idea if these tend to wear out on the F06 as well? (They don't look replacable though, they look rivetted in rather than bolted).











And below is a photo of the U joint

[suj999]

I suppose the rubber could get old and cause issues, but I am out of ideas on if thats a known issue.

For the Mini, I took it to a specialist as I have had some work by them in the past, (www.1320.co.uk) and they thought it would be the u joint too.

[rorz12]

Originally Posted by suj999

I suppose the rubber could get old and cause issues, but I am out of ideas on if thats a known issue.

For the Mini, I took it to a specialist as I have had some work by them in the past, (www.1320.co.uk) and they thought it would be the u joint too.

Thanks. I'll try and remove the universal joint this weekend and have a look at it's condition.

There's seems to be an adjustable pin on the electric steering rack as well, which from what I've seen online, can cause some knocking sounds and looseness as well. I don't really want to touch this as it seems a pain to get the position it just right. But I wonder if anyone here has adjusted/replaced the thrust bushing on the 6er before?

[Johnkwick]

Hi,

F10 user here

Ergh I have exactly the same noise as yours (knocking and squeaking/rattling/whatnot)

I just replaced my steering rack a month ago under warranty and soon I heard mentioned noise from the steering wheel. Dealer spoke to me and they said it was coming from the u joint. I'm still searching for a replacement (not covered under warranty, dealership quoted me for $450 part + labor), the ones from ebay are quite cheap but I don't think those are in good condition

Perhaps I can help you to rule out that it was coming from steering rack.

[rorz12]

Originally Posted by Johnkwick

Hi,

F10 user here

Ergh I have exactly the same noise as yours (knocking and squeaking/rattling/whatnot)

I just replaced my steering rack a month ago under warranty and soon I heard mentioned noise from the steering wheel. Dealer spoke to me and they said it was coming from the u joint. I'm still searching for a replacement (not covered under warranty, dealership quoted me for $450 part + labor), the ones from ebay are quite cheap but I don't think those are in good condition

Perhaps I can help you to rule out that it was coming from steering rack.

Hi. Thanks for the input. It's not only that knocking sound I get from steering wheel but also when I go over sharp speed bumps there's a sound from the front end like something heavy is loose. Even though the front suspension is all new and all bolts have been checked.

I came across another post on bimmerfest I think, and a guy had tried everything to find out where the sound was coming from. In the end tightening the thrust pin bolt on the steering rack solved it.

My mechanic is coming over today and gonna have him remove the U joint assembly to have a look at it before I buy a new one. I suspect both the U joint and steering rack bolt need fixing to eliminate both sounds.

[Johnkwick]

Originally Posted by rorz12

Hi. Thanks for the input. It's not only that knocking sound I get from steering wheel but also when I go over sharp speed bumps there's a sound from the front end like something heavy is loose. Even though the front suspension is all new and all bolts have been checked.

I came across another post on bimmerfest I think, and a guy had tried everything to find out where the sound was coming from. In the end tightening the thrust pin bolt on the steering rack solved it.

My mechanic is coming over today and gonna have him remove the U joint assembly to have a look at it before I buy a new one. I suspect both the U joint and steering rack bolt need fixing to eliminate both sounds.

does it sound like the ones in the vid below?

It was coming from the crossbraces which need to be re-torqued on both sides.

Please let me know how do you solve the problem once your mechanic is done fixing your car, the sound was subtle but never fail to drive me insane

[rorz12]

Originally Posted by Johnkwick

does it sound like the ones in the vid below?

It was coming from the crossbraces which need to be re-torqued on both sides.

Please let me know how do you solve the problem once your mechanic is done fixing your car, the sound was subtle but never fail to drive me insane

Not really. I have 2 separate issues.

First issue is the sound in the video in my first post. That's a knocking sound from somewhere in the steering system. With the car stationary and engine on, I can place the steering wheel at a certain angle where I create tension between the wheels and the steering wheel and it will just continue knocking without my hands on the steering wheel.. (forward to 1:20 in my video) and sounds like its coming from either rack or column. I'm going to replace the U joint and see if it solves my problem.

Second issue is when I go over small sharp rubber speed bumps like the ones in parking lots, I hear and feel like something heavy is loose. It almost feels/sounds like a bad shock absorber/strut. Except it's not because my front suspension is all new (new strut mounts, struts, lower and upper control arms/wishbones, sway bar end links, sway bar bushings, inner and outer tie rods..). You would expect it to feel so tight and solid with new bushings and suspension. Also driving on cobble stone roads, the car does not feel like it has a brand new front suspension. I can feel all the bumps/rattling through the steering wheel and feels like my suspension/bushings need an overhaul.

So I came across some similar complaints/posts online that said it's coming from the steering rack so my mechanic tightened the cap for the thrust pin/bushing by 4 notches (images below) and it has helped somewhat. For example the cobble stone road bumps and noise has been reduced significantly, I would say almost completely. However, the sound from speed bumps hasn't changed that much. I still have that heavy loose feeling. Steering wheel feels tighter and more solid.

Cross braces, are you talking about the ones on top of the engine bay? Those are tight. I haven't checked the ones in front of the radiator.

[rorz12]

Originally Posted by Johnkwick

Hi,

F10 user here

Ergh I have exactly the same noise as yours (knocking and squeaking/rattling/whatnot)

I just replaced my steering rack a month ago under warranty and soon I heard mentioned noise from the steering wheel. Dealer spoke to me and they said it was coming from the u joint. I'm still searching for a replacement (not covered under warranty, dealership quoted me for $450 part + labor), the ones from ebay are quite cheap but I don't think those are in good condition

Perhaps I can help you to rule out that it was coming from steering rack.

I ordered the U-joint at the dealership, wasn't in stock though so its coming from Germany. $450 sounds a lot. Where are you living? It shows as about $200 to $250 new online (in USA). I got mine for $240 from the dealership but I get 40% discount on parts because the car just passed 10 years old.

Tightening the steering rack bolt fixed the rattling on cobble stone roads, but the left/right knocking is still there. So hopefully this should fix it. Will update in few weeks.

[rorz12]

Originally Posted by Johnkwick

It was coming from the crossbraces which need to be re-torqued on both sides.

Please let me know how do you solve the problem once your mechanic is done fixing your car, the sound was subtle but never fail to drive me insane

Thanks for the tip about the cross braces, actually the front left one that sits in front of the radiator wasn't screwed back onto the top support! It was just left hanging.. So I screwed that back on and the sound is almost completely gone.

[rorz12]

Originally Posted by Johnkwick

Hi,

F10 user here

Ergh I have exactly the same noise as yours (knocking and squeaking/rattling/whatnot)

I just replaced my steering rack a month ago under warranty and soon I heard mentioned noise from the steering wheel. Dealer spoke to me and they said it was coming from the u joint. I'm still searching for a replacement (not covered under warranty, dealership quoted me for $450 part + labor), the ones from ebay are quite cheap but I don't think those are in good condition

Perhaps I can help you to rule out that it was coming from steering rack.

So I replaced the U joint and I still got the knocking sound. When I put the steering wheel into the knocking position and put my hand on the tie rod, I can feel it coming from the steering rack. And since I already tightened the steering thrust piece bolt, the only thing I can think of is the actual thrust piece bushing must be worn.

Problem is, BMW doesn't offer a repair kit for this rack. They just replace the whole rack...

They have a repair kit (below) for the F20s/F30s but I'm not sure what the bushing inside my rack looks like and whether it would work.

[Johnkwick]

Uff that's bad. Will they refund your money since it's not resolving your problem? I think I'm in a strong bargaining position if I decide to go through dealership route. If it's not solving the problem then I could refuse to pay for a "misdiagnosed" root of cause and if it's coming from the rack, I can ask for a replacement for free

I also want to share my experience regarding turning the thrust piece, the last time I did that, it didn't take long before my steering rack went toast. But I guess it's because I turned it too much.

I think it's best for you to source a used steering rack. Lots of indy in Indonesia import used bmw parts from Dubai. Not sure if you can find it

[rorz12]

Originally Posted by Johnkwick

Uff that's bad. Will they refund your money since it's not resolving your problem? I think I'm in a strong bargaining position if I decide to go through dealership route. If it's not solving the problem then I could refuse to pay for a "misdiagnosed" root of cause and if it's coming from the rack, I can ask for a replacement for free

I also want to share my experience regarding turning the thrust piece, the last time I did that, it didn't take long before my steering rack went toast. But I guess it's because I turned it too much.

I think it's best for you to source a used steering rack. Lots of indy in Indonesia import used bmw parts from Dubai. Not sure if you can find it

No I didn't do it at BMW, I used my mechanic. I've turnd the thrust piece bolt 4 notches, it feels good and solid, not too tight, so hopefully it won't go toast.. plus it resolved the rattling over cobbled roads.

I've heard about the used racks from Dubai. Apparently they cost in the region of 750-1000 euros. I think I'm going to leave this problem on the back burner for now as it's not a critical fix and it's quite expensive. It's definitely annoying, but it doesn't happen all the time. New rack will set me back 1700 euros.