Is this 650 GC worth it?

[Houranimd49]

I know this topic has been beat to death and trust me I’ve spent countless hours reading and researching the N63tu amongst various forums… but I have yet to make an informed decision based on my personal situation.

I have had my F10 535 for nearly 5 years and 60k miles which have been virtually trouble free. I love the car and ultimately it drives better than the day I got it as I’m always on top of the maintenance which I do myself. Along the way I’ve had a few other N55 powered cars and definitely have driven the N63tu in F10 and F06 platform.

As those of us who know, the V8’s power is intoxicating. While the N55 is stout and reliable, I still want a V8 but I’ve been on the fence about it as the forums appear to be echo chambers about issues and problems rather than “normal” people who drive their car 90% normal and 10% rip it on an on/off ramp with occasional highway passing. This is the demographic I’m looking for.

I found a 2016 650i xDrive GC in black sapphire metallic that I absolutely fell in love with. It’s at an amazing price but it has been in an accident before which I found pictures of and the damage encountered doesn’t bother me too much. I’ve seen worse. Mileage is 85000…maintenance records on CARFAX appear regular.

My question is, is it worth giving up my perfectly fine F10 N55 to daily drive this 650? My work commute is 80% highway roughly 40 miles to and from work. Once a week I may drive 40 miles one way to see my family. I don’t drive my vehicles hard but I do enjoy the occasional on and off ramp experience and I do tend to pass on the highway often.

-not entirely concerned about fuel consumption. I’m sure my driving style and commute wont drain my wallet that bad. Im mostly concerned with the day in and day out operation and how much more maintenance I’m likely to encounter. As my N55 hasn’t been that bad considering…95% of the time I can start it up and go without feeling like an issue will arise. Even then, it’ll be me who will fix it.

-I do want the power and I do want the elevated sport and luxury offered by the 6 series. After all since having the F10 it’s hard to go backwards.

[Low Country Larry]

Hello Sir - Understood! I have had my 2015 since 2017, drive it just about every day and pretty much the way you describe, plus the occasional 6-hour trip to a city easier to drive than fly to. I put on about 10K miles per year. Knock on wood, never had a problem, just the normal stuff (by the way, it is not kind to tires, and they are not cheap). Every time I look at it, I get a thrill, and every time I drive it, I feel special. It is elegant and powerful and very comfortable. Good luck to you!

[Qsilver7]

I'm on my 2nd f06 650ix GC...so I'm not sure I can provide any dissent. The 1st was a 2013 and the 2nd one is a 2015. I loved/love them both. And I also have an f15 X5 50i...so what can of fool am I?

If you know what you're getting into...and have the financial means for maintenance...you only have one life to live...might as well enjoy it.

I only traded the 2013 for the 2015 for similar reason you are espousing. I liked the NBT/ID4 iDrive' resolution better than the CIC...and I also liked the touch-pad iDrive controller knob on the 2015.

I also traded for int/ext color difference, too. My 2013 was BSM (black sapphire metallic) which also had a black Nappa interior. I drive my sedans more in the late spring/summer/early fall (the hot season) and the black on black was starting to wear on me. I loved the look when it was clean...but the dust appeared all too quickly. The 2015 had the rare Moonstone Metallic exterior and Cohiba brown full Merino interior...so the rare paint which can hide the dust much longer and a slightly lighter interior and more luxurious Merino leather (which extended to the lower dash and lower part of the doors) gave me incentive to make the jump.

Any used car purchase is a gamble...so do your due diligence to make sure she's not just bandaged up to get a sale.

[Houranimd49]

Originally Posted by Low Country Larry

Hello Sir - Understood! I have had my 2015 since 2017, drive it just about every day and pretty much the way you describe, plus the occasional 6-hour trip to a city easier to drive than fly to. I put on about 10K miles per year. Knock on wood, never had a problem, just the normal stuff (by the way, it is not kind to tires, and they are not cheap). Every time I look at it, I get a thrill, and every time I drive it, I feel special. It is elegant and powerful and very comfortable. Good luck to you!

I appreciate you responsding and your personal insight! What would you say were the major costs for you in the 2 years of daily driven ownership?

For my N55 I would say the most expensive repairs was really the water pump, brakes, and one axle. Although those were all purchased through fcp euro (lifetime warranty) and I did the labor myself.

[Houranimd49]

Originally Posted by Qsilver7

I'm on my 2nd f06 650ix GC...so I'm not sure I can provide any dissent. The 1st was a 2013 and the 2nd one is a 2015. I loved/love them both. And I also have an f15 X5 50i...so what can of fool am I?

If you know what you're getting into...and have the financial means for maintenance...you only have one life to live...might as well enjoy it.

I only traded the 2013 for the 2015 for similar reason you are espousing. I liked the NBT/ID4 iDrive' resolution better than the CIC...and I also liked the touch-pad iDrive controller knob on the 2015.

I also traded for int/ext color difference, too. My 2013 was BSM (black sapphire metallic) which also had a black Nappa interior. I drive my sedans more in the late spring/summer/early fall (the hot season) and the black on black was starting to wear on me. I loved the look when it was clean...but the dust appeared all too quickly. The 2015 had the rear Moonstone Metallic exterior and Cohiba brown full Merino interior...so the rare paint which can hide the dust much longer and a slightly lighter interior and more luxurious gave me incentive to make the jump.

Any used car purchase is a gamble...so do your due diligence to make sure she's not just bandaged up to get a sale.

Your cars are beautiful. I want to hear good stories like yours! I’ve heard and read enough bad ones.

I’m on board about the black paint being a chore to clean but frankly I find it therapeutic and rewarding once it is clean. I have paint corrected my BSM F10 twice in the last 4.5 years and always only hand wash so it glimmers in the sun with essentially no swirling.


Agreed about the gamble, I’m just fighting a purchase that is more a desire than need considering my current car is perfectly fine 😅

What was your most expensive repairs or costs in the two you’ve owned? Oil? Gasoline? Or certain maintenance items?

[JBF650]

I don't daily my LCI 2015 650 F13 but I do take it on long journeys from time to time. I bought the car 5 years ago with 25k klms on it, its now got 65k Klms on it. ( we use klms here in Aus ) I have it serviced every year ie oil changes without fail at my BMW specialists dealership regardless of 'mileage'. I only use the top quality 98RON fuel in all my cars. I can honestly say I've never had a problem. All routine maintenance is done when the car goes in. I have done the plugs and I think BMW replaced a few injectors early in the cars life according to its service history. I might spend around $500-1000 per year on servicing ... its not really that much tbh.
How I drive the car depends on my mood... hard and fast or relaxed and cruisy just depends. It does love exercising its turbos and that V8 sounds bloody awesome above 5k rpms !!! l like the immense surge of power when on an open country road or motorway and my right foot gets twitchy .
Our 650 cars are too big and heavy to be 'nimble sports cars'.... rather they are grand tourers with all the power and handling you'll ever need. A motorway or country road is great to storm down with the muted but very menacing V8 in the background. Id stay away from 'tuned' or 'chipped' cars... these have usually had hard lives....
Its been said many times, make sure the car has been well maintained and serviced regularly, you can check this in the cars idrive system. The TU is a good upgrade and the LCIs have some subtle improvements as well. One thing I would certainly encourage is putting a set of Michelins Pilots 4s on it if its still running it's god awful RFT ditch them ! they ruin the ride of the car.
good luck and happy hunting they are lovely cars to own , and I've never regretted buy mine. I still look back at it when i park it and think wow its a fabulous looking thing !

[Qsilver7]

Originally Posted by Houranimd49

What was your most expensive repairs or costs in the two you’ve owned? Oil? Gasoline? Or certain maintenance items?

The 2013’s biggest expense was a complete front & rear brake pads/rotors/sensors. That came to a bit over $2K since i had it done at the local BMW dealership. The next highest expense were tires…the winter set was approx $1k and the summer set was approx $800. Other than that it was regular maintenance stuff like oil service/brake fluid service.

The 2015’s biggest expense has been new tires (approx $1k), and a new BMW 105AH battery ($227 from the local BMW dealership’s parts dept…I installed & register it myself). I’m using the same winter tires from the 2013…and the summer tires are non runflats…had to get rid of the runflats on both cars.

For the services you can’t do yourself or don’t want to do if you don’t have to…try checking the BMW value Service offers by your local BMW dealerships. Here’s a link, just input your zip code…then your car info to see what services they offer. Some of them are pretty competitive.

https://bmwusaservice.com/valueservice

[Houranimd49]

Originally Posted by Qsilver7

The 2013’s biggest expense was a complete front & rear brake pads/rotors/sensors. That came to a bit over $2K since i had it done at the local BMW dealership. The next highest expense were tires…the winter set was approx $1k and the summer set was approx $800. Other than that it was regular maintenance stuff like oil service/brake fluid service.

The 2015’s biggest expense has been new tires (approx $1k), and a new BMW 105AH battery ($227 from the local BMW dealership’s parts dept…I installed & register it myself). I’m using the same winter tires from the 2013…and the summer tires are non runflats…had to get rid of the runflats on both cars.

For the services you can’t do yourself or don’t want to do if you don’t have to…try checking the BMW value Service offers by your local BMW dealerships. Here’s a link, just input your zip code…then your car info to see what services they offer. Some of them are pretty competitive.

https://bmwusaservice.com/valueservice

Your ownership experiences as you mentioned is really more or less identical to my F10 in the 4.5-5 years I’ve had it. I forgot to mention the $800 Bridgestone RFT’s on my F10 I did get two years ago. Albeit maybe less in money because I did all the labor minus tire install. So this is good news. I can handle this level of maintenance.

Thank you for the link as well. Very useful for the future when I’m really strapped for time.

[Houranimd49]

Originally Posted by JBF650

I don't daily my LCI 2015 650 F13 but I do take it on long journeys from time to time. I bought the car 5 years ago with 25k klms on it, its now got 65k Klms on it. ( we use klms here in Aus ) I have it serviced every year ie oil changes without fail at my BMW specialists dealership regardless of 'mileage'. I only use the top quality 98RON fuel in all my cars. I can honestly say I've never had a problem. All routine maintenance is done when the car goes in. I have done the plugs and I think BMW replaced a few injectors early in the cars life according to its service history. I might spend around $500-1000 per year on servicing ... its not really that much tbh.
How I drive the car depends on my mood... hard and fast or relaxed and cruisy just depends. It does love exercising its turbos and that V8 sounds bloody awesome above 5k rpms !!! l like the immense surge of power when on an open country road or motorway and my right foot gets twitchy .
Our 650 cars are too big and heavy to be 'nimble sports cars'.... rather they are grand tourers with all the power and handling you'll ever need. A motorway or country road is great to storm down with the muted but very menacing V8 in the background. Id stay away from 'tuned' or 'chipped' cars... these have usually had hard lives....
Its been said many times, make sure the car has been well maintained and serviced regularly, you can check this in the cars idrive system. The TU is a good upgrade and the LCIs have some subtle improvements as well. One thing I would certainly encourage is putting a set of Michelins Pilots [...]

I’ve had several BMWs in the past and most recently an E82 135i with the 6MT. While I enjoyed it, I still love my 535 more because I find myself enjoying the highway cruisers better. Even my wife’s X3 35i m sport…as quick and fun as it is, I still prefer my F10 all around. So I can only imagine how much better than F06 is in this regard.

Although you don’t daily your car (which is beautiful btw), would you choose to if you could?

[JBF650]

Originally Posted by Houranimd49

I’ve had several BMWs in the past and most recently an E82 135i with the 6MT. While I enjoyed it, I still love my 535 more because I find myself enjoying the highway cruisers better. Even my wife’s X3 35i m sport…as quick and fun as it is, I still prefer my F10 all around. So I can only imagine how much better than F06 is in this regard.

Although you don’t daily your car (which is beautiful btw), would you choose to if you could?

Of course I would drive my 650 every day, yes. Im the big 50 next year and at this stage of my life I prefer my cars with power and comfort over hard bumpy cramped sports cars. However I’ve a few cars and I don’t need to drive anything every day. I actually drive my 2010 Range Rover Sport Supercharged the most out of all my cars.. Tbh I find the Rangie the easiest and most comfortable to just get in and go compared to my BMW and Merc SL55. …. I don’t have children so my cars take their place lol 😝.

Thank you it’s a lovely example I agree ! I do get a bit ocd with my cars…. Sapphire black metallic does take effort to keep clean!

[TGrits10]

Originally Posted by Houranimd49

As those of us who know, the V8’s power is intoxicating. While the N55 is stout and reliable, I still want a V8 but I’ve been on the fence about it as the forums appear to be echo chambers about issues and problems rather than “normal” people who drive their car 90% normal and 10% rip it on an on/off ramp with occasional highway passing. This is the demographic I’m looking for.

I dare say I am your demographic then, enjoying the luxo-barge experience 90% of the time, ripping it when I can which isn't as often as I'd like. Having considered the N55's sufficient stoutness and relative reliability, I ultimately found myself intoxicated by the V8 and accepting its foibles as a trade off.

Originally Posted by Houranimd49

I found a 2016 650i xDrive GC in black sapphire metallic that I absolutely fell in love with. It’s at an amazing price but it has been in an accident before which I found pictures of and the damage encountered doesn’t bother me too much. I’ve seen worse. Mileage is 85000…maintenance records on CARFAX appear regular.

The mileage makes me a little nervous, to start there means 6 digits is coming soon, and I've had too many experiences with high-mileage bimmers to want to do that again. I got my car with 32k on it, it's had its share of (expected, but still aggravating) issues along the way to the low 70's now, and I'm already thinking I only want to keep it for a couple more years so I don't have to deal with the wife complaining every time something comes up that requires my time/attention/money, which only increases with age and mileage.

Originally Posted by Houranimd49

My question is, is it worth giving up my perfectly fine F10 N55 to daily drive this 650? My work commute is 80% highway roughly 40 miles to and from work. Once a week I may drive 40 miles one way to see my family. I don’t drive my vehicles hard but I do enjoy the occasional on and off ramp experience and I do tend to pass on the highway often.

I say yes it is worth it. Even in casual driving, the V8 shines. It can deliver effortless silent push, it can deliver impressive low/mid range torque accompanied by a nice rumble, it can compress your lungs and warp you through that yellow light, and generally it can make a 4,500lb car feel a whole lot lighter than that, all while sounding positively glorious. I also highly recommend a flash tune as a no-brainer plug-and-play enhancement to the warp drive experience, no need to mod anything (well maybe spark plugs), just pop in the tune and enjoy even more crazy torque.

Originally Posted by Houranimd49

-not entirely concerned about fuel consumption. I’m sure my driving style and commute wont drain my wallet that bad.

I realized at some point that the cost of fuel is really a drop in the bucket of the overall ownership/operating costs, so averaging 5mpg more or less isn't worth fretting about imo.

Originally Posted by Houranimd49

I'm mostly concerned with the day in and day out operation and how much more maintenance I’m likely to encounter. As my N55 hasn’t been that bad considering…95% of the time I can start it up and go without feeling like an issue will arise. Even then, it’ll be me who will fix it.

My experience with the V8 vs N55 has been less maintenance and more known issues cropping up and being a pain. Let's make a list:
-Plugs and coils at ~35k due to rough idle and occasional misfires. Rough idle remained.
-High pressure fuel pumps, both sides crapped out before 50k, covered to 100k under extended warranty bc known issue, but still the aggravation of getting the dealership to correctly diagnose the issue and do the warranty replacement without insisting I blow 4 figures on other things first was an absolute nightmare, both times. And I think I have one going bad again, based on mild symptoms cropping up recently. Fun.
-Turbo coolant lines leaking. Again a known issue, not warrantied, have to take apart the whole top of the engine bay to get at em. Had to go in there twice bc after I replaced a bunch of leaking connections, another one even further down/in blew out and had my car down for a couple weeks until I could get to it.
-Mystery fuel mix issue. CEL that comes and goes, codes indicate an intermittent lean condition, fuel consumption is steady, could be a number of things, all of them expensive, been dragging my feet on tracking it down bc the car's running fine and life is busy as all getout.

Originally Posted by Houranimd49

-I do want the power and I do want the elevated sport and luxury offered by the 6 series. After all since having the F10 it’s hard to go backwards.

I will say the F06 is step up from the F10 in just about every category, the exception being day-to-day ergonomics/comfort, i.e. annoying to get in/out, reduced visibility, stiffer ride, less back seat space. The styling is gorgeous, inside and out. BMW really went all out on the interior, it's not just luxury and convenience, it's aesthetically pleasing and artistic in a very un-German way. The 650i comes standard with all the top goodies too, some of which aren't even available on the 5. It's like a 7-series level of interior PLUS they went out of their way to make it pretty.

I think someone else said this but the combination of the sexy styling, the outstanding interior, and the V8 make it special every time I drive it.

[Opie55]

I daily a 2015 convertible and I cannot say I have had any expense over what I would have if it were a N55 other than it takes two air filters and some more oil. But at 9 years and 58,000 miles the only repair forward of the firewall was to replace the old style crankcase breather hoses that crack from heat. Nothing else. Otherwise, oil, filters and one set of plugs I did myself for $57. The only thing that makes the car expensive to own is gas, really. Driving it around town you can pretty much see the needle moving down.

[Low Country Larry]

You asked about my maintenance expenses. Similar to the above comments in terms of oil and tires. At 45,000 miles the dealer replaced rear brakes, pads, sensors, total $577. The last tires I got were $330 each, ouch.

One problem I will "warn" you about and maybe waste everybody's time on the forum. At the front of the car (this is a 2015 F06) on the underside is a rubber (or poly-whatever) pan. It has a lip. For some reason, the lip started catching on concrete parking bumpers, so that when I backed up to leave the lip would pull some of the underside with it. I tried cutting off part of the lip. But sadly, one fateful day when I backed out I pulled the front bumper assembly several inches away from the car.

You may at this point rightly point out that I should be more careful parking. I tried that, but obviously not hard enough! The repair and replacement and asking the dealer to saw off the protruding parts of the stupid and (to me) useless pan came to well into the four-figure range.

[Chaos236]

Currently drive a 17 640i GC that shares dd with a 16 Cayenne.Previously owned three different older 5’s. Way more room in the 5,keep yours.

[Qsilver7]

Originally Posted by Low Country Larry

One problem I will "warn" you about and maybe waste everybody's time on the forum. At the front of the car (this is a 2015 F06) on the underside is a rubber (or poly-whatever) pan. It has a lip. For some reason, the lip started catching on concrete parking bumpers, so that when I backed up to leave the lip would pull some of the underside with it. I tried cutting off part of the lip. But sadly, one fateful day when I backed out I pulled the front bumper assembly several inches away from the car.

You may at this point rightly point out that I should be more careful parking. I tried that, but obviously not hard enough! .

Do you have surround (top down) view? If yes, I would use this feature anytime you are driving forward into a parking space that has one of those concrete bumpers...or if there is a raised walk or any low barrier that could catch anything underneath the front of the car.

Or...stop and back into the space instead of driving forward into it....or just select another parking space that doesn't present any possible parking hazards.

When I'm near low barriers (parking spaces, exit drives, etc) I simply press the PDC button to get a top down view of these parking hazards to protect my wheels and front end underparts. And if you turn on the "guidelines" you can see if your forward/rearward projection is lined up with the low lying obstacle.

[Low Country Larry]

General, here I thought I knew everything - thanks so much for this great idea!

[Qsilver7]

No problem...our shared/learned experiences is what makes the forums such a great place.

And if you get the rear view (back-up) camera when you initiate PDC...if you have the top icon (on the left in the pics above) selected...to quickly switch between rear view & top down view is a simple downward press of the iDrive controller knob.

The camera will usually go directly to the last view it used...and since most driver's back out of their driveway at the start of the day...just a simple downward press of the iDrive controller will swap to the top down/surround view if you manually select PDC and the rear view is what you see.

[Houranimd49]

Everyone I appreciate all of your responses with much insight.

I went to see the car today. Some key notes:

Body: nearly immaculate. Whoever did the body work is a 10/10. Paint is matched on the fender. Nearly no scratches or even swirls. No dents.

Interior: very clean. Will need a detail. No tears or scratches.

Drive: excellent. Tracks straight, no vibrations, no funny business. Shifts great. Brakes feel great. Almost comparable to my F10, except much more torque.

Engine: I searched high and low for leaks. Everything is dry. Seller states he did the valve stem seals as they were leaking.

Now on further inspection of the engine… I pulled the beauty cover off and took note of the turbo coolant lines. They appear pliable, no cracks. But guess what? I found two silicone couplers, “Arm” brand coming off the turbos into the intercooler. Hmmm… someone’s been in here having fun.


Seller starts the car.. that’s an interesting volume.. nice growl. Hold on… I smell a smell… a smelly smell, a smelly smell that smells... smelly (Mr. Krabs)… catless downpipes.

This threw me off. The seller appeared to have no knowledge of this. But I didn’t want this. I wanted a nice quiet and non smelly car. But I suppose I could look past this if the price is reduced. And maybe source out used catalytic converters. There was no check engine light so clearly there’s a tune attached to this car to eliminate that.

Overall, I like the car. I give it an 8/10. But those downpipes. That holds me back.

What would you guys suggest?

Edit: I’m adding a photo of the car. Notice the resting position of the windshield wipers. That’s not normal. How can that be remedied?

[scubachris]

hi.
re wiper position..when i wash my car i can just gently pull the wipers up to the position in your last picture then fold them off the windscreen to enable me to wash the windscreen then fold them back to that position..when the ignition is next turned on the wipers park in the correct position,
im not sure if this is uk spec only,i doubt it.
so if you do go to see the car again,put the ignition on ,or turn wipers on then off and they should park in the correct position.
there is a very slight chance the limit switch in the wiper mechanism which dictates park position has failed but very unlikely..
i would think he has just washed the car/windscreen when you took the picture.
this manual lift up function is to enable wiper blade replacement.

[scubachris]

also regarding the cat delete.
a stage 1 tune is just a remap/reflash,which does give considerable increase in torque/bhp.
stage 2 tune is bigger intercooler and catted downpipe removal and an associated reflash for even more power .
a previos owner of this car obviously wasnt satisfied with stage 1 tune and went to a more extreme stage 2 tune.
extreme not the right phrase really as you dont mention hybrid turbos ect..but how would you know?maybe qsilver could give more info on this.
there are plenty 2nd hand catted downpipes for sale on ebay as its not uncommon to remove them.
refitting catted downpipes isnt too hard a job.can be done from engone bay,and 1.5 to 2 hours,buy you would then need a reflash,stage 1 tune.
im wondering if it has been tuned through an ecu reflash or if there is a jb or similar tuning box somewhere?
650s are very very rare in the uk,i have only seen 2 or 3 ever.so my knowledge is limited,but qsilver and opie are more knowledgable on 650s.
i personally wouldnt have an issue with stage 1 tune but stage 2 tune would put me off.
if you decide to fit catted downpipes/labour//stage 1 generic reflash.i guess $1000 should be doable.

[Houranimd49]

Did I make a poor financial decision? Maybe.

[Luftpost]

Not too many decision's with cars are "good financial decisions"..... so let that rest with you as it may.

I noticed that the wheels are also not style 351 or 373, so not 650 OEM, though they do look like M6 wheels, don't know the Style #, but then there is the offset question.

As far as I know, valve stem seals were not an issue on the N63TU. Since this one (2016) is a TU, you have the new and improved version.

My 2016 650 I have had now for at least 3+ years, and put 40,000+ mostly trouble free miles on it (new O2 sensors DIY). It now has 83,XXX. Still running strong. I am the second owner and I do baby it, with the occasional sprint but ONLY when the oil temperature is up to normal operating temp. Next oil change I am doing a Blackstone Oil analysis to see what I can learn from it.

Let us know how it goes.

L