getting 650 GC to 90%+ of M6?

[Dutt1113]

I am looking into purchasing a 2017 650 GC in the spring and was looking into performance modding it with an exhaust, tune, intake and lowering springs. I was thinking stage 1 tune from maybe bootmod3, DME, RK, etc. Then i got to thinking Catless DP's which are cheap even for good ones (~$500) and going stage 2 tune for a little more power, but mostly for sound. For exhaust i wanted to keep the valves so go with m6 comp mufflers and then add the catless DP's. Would that be too loud or drone? I wanted to get to m6ish power levels without getting an m6 which will not only cost more, but there's things i don't like about the M6. First, it has RWD and would not be good for Michigan weather. Second, it doesn't have the nice digital cluster like 650 does and it lacks ACC which is nice for highway driving. For stage 1/2, would a new intercooler or better/more durable charge pipe be needed?

[iamvanja]

You won't find my post entirely useful based on your questions, but my 2 cents are to keep in mind that 650 and M6 do not have exactly the same engine. S63 is enforced better for performance and to deal with the extra heat. Then again, there were 2 recent cases on M6 forum of an engine seize!
I personally stay away from the BMW's V8s but you are already driving one so I suppose you know what you are getting yourself into.

On the digital dash - it certainly looks modern, but I am surprised at how little I look at it with the HUD.

[jjasonSU]

For all those mods i'd start out with an M6

[ezmaass]

Originally Posted by Dutt1113

I am looking into purchasing a 2017 650 GC in the spring and was looking into performance modding it with an exhaust, tune, intake and lowering springs. I was thinking stage 1 tune from maybe bootmod3, DME, RK, etc. Then i got to thinking Catless DP's which are cheap even for good ones (~$500) and going stage 2 tune for a little more power, but mostly for sound. For exhaust i wanted to keep the valves so go with m6 comp mufflers and then add the catless DP's. Would that be too loud or drone? I wanted to get to m6ish power levels without getting an m6 which will not only cost more, but there's things i don't like about the M6. First, it has RWD and would not be good for Michigan weather. Second, it doesn't have the nice digital cluster like 650 does and it lacks ACC which is nice for highway driving. For stage 1/2, would a new intercooler or better/more durable charge pipe be needed?

It's important to know what you want to get out of the car. Of course, most car guys have "more power" on the shopping list. But, to be honest, it's just not as important as it used to be - at least not since sedans started coming with 400+ horsepower.

My 650xi GC, which happens to be a 2017 model, is a daily driver. I've had it now for about 3 years, and I have no complaints with regards to power. When I was ordering it, I was waffling between the 650 and M6. I ultimately went with the 650 because the pros of the 650 outweighed the pros of the M6 for my specific situation.

At the top of the list for me:

- xDrive: living in the northeast, all wheel drive is a nice benefit. Don't get me wrong, I've lived with RWD BMWs for years, and you can safely drive them in the snow. But given that this is my DD, I'm more concerned with safety and convenience than I am with squeezing out a bit more fun from the handling.

- Suspension: Again, as a DD, I was more concerned with having a comfortable suspension that wouldn't beat me up on longer trips. The adjustable suspension of the 650 gave me a comfortable "every day" setting while also incorporating a "sport" option for the (few and far between) times when I want to actually push the car harder than the comfort mode will tolerate. Likewise, by ticking the "adaptive drive" option during the ordering process, I also got the Active Roll Stabilization (ARS), which gives the car active anti-roll bars to reduce cornering roll, while also using the dynamic dampers to reduce squat and dive. It's honestly as sporty as I could ever hope to use a 4400lb car.

I fully loaded my 650xi GC - including ACC, adaptive drive, night vision, executive package, cold weather, B&O stereo, driver assistance, active seats, M Sport, the works. MSRP came to $113k, which represented a nice savings over the equivalent loaded M6 GC and gave me more of what I thought would be valuable for my specific lifestyle / usage of the car. Three years later, and with only 10k miles on the clock, the car is basically like new - and given the disappointment of the 8/8GC styling, I still can't think of a better option out there!

Now, can you get a lot more power out of the N63TU? Yeah, without a doubt. I'd just watch that you don't compromise reliability in the process. These engines were largely designed to propel large luxury cars down the autobahn at speed with good passing capability... but it's not an engine I would stress with anything resembling sport-oriented driving, no less full on racing (yes, I've seen guys taking 550's to drag strips - silly and abusive).

[AccordTR]

Originally Posted by Dutt1113

I am looking into purchasing a 2017 650 GC in the spring and was looking into performance modding it with an exhaust, tune, intake and lowering springs. I was thinking stage 1 tune from maybe bootmod3, DME, RK, etc. Then i got to thinking Catless DP's which are cheap even for good ones (~$500) and going stage 2 tune for a little more power, but mostly for sound. For exhaust i wanted to keep the valves so go with m6 comp mufflers and then add the catless DP's. Would that be too loud or drone? I wanted to get to m6ish power levels without getting an m6 which will not only cost more, but there's things i don't like about the M6. First, it has RWD and would not be good for Michigan weather. Second, it doesn't have the nice digital cluster like 650 does and it lacks ACC which is nice for highway driving. For stage 1/2, would a new intercooler or better/more durable charge pipe be needed?

I'm your guy. I run BM3 stage 2, arm catless dps, muffler delete, straight pipe exhaust, 1 step colder NGK plugs, and snow performance water methanol injection. I have no issues beating stock m6's. I have also gone against a stage 1 m6 and it was basically equal. The xdrive platform gives us a huge advantage in launch. I also have xDelete so I can flash to rwd only too.

The N63TU is definitely a strong motor and with very good maintenance it can easily run 600+ hp no problem. Many of the internals are the same between the s63 and n63, rods are good to about 700lbs of torque for both for example. There are numerous 550/650 in the mid to high 11 1/4 mile times. The car can put down some serious numbers.

[pdubq]

Accord,
Do you happen to have the ngk part number you running? I’m guessing SILZKBR8D8S

Mandatory to gap them down? Or did you have it at pregap .030 in?

Originally Posted by AccordTR

I'm your guy. I run BM3 stage 2, arm catless dps, muffler delete, straight pipe exhaust, 1 step colder NGK plugs, and snow performance water methanol injection. I have no issues beating stock m6's. I have also gone against a stage 1 m6 and it was basically equal. The xdrive platform gives us a huge advantage in launch. I also have xDelete so I can flash to rwd only too.

The N63TU is definitely a strong motor and with very good maintenance it can easily run 600+ hp no problem. Many of the internals are the same between the s63 and n63, rods are good to about 700lbs of torque for both for example. There are numerous 550/650 in the mid to high 11 1/4 mile times. The car can put down some serious numbers.

[AccordTR]

Originally Posted by pdubq

Accord,
Do you happen to have the ngk part number you running? I’m guessing SILZKBR8D8S

Mandatory to gap them down? Or did you have it at pregap .030 in?

No I'm running NGK 95770 x 8 at .02 gap. That's what most of us run with bm3 stage 2.

[pdubq]

Originally Posted by AccordTR

No I'm running NGK 95770 x 8 at .02 gap. That's what most of us run with bm3 stage 2.

Hey AccordTR!

I’ve been rolling around the idea of getting xDelete, not necessarily for performance, just for fun, RWD-feel, and to see how the steering feel changes on this particular car! My last RWD was tuned E60 535i, and while lower power and kinda heavy, was a blast to drive, So the idea of being able to go back and forth between AWD and RWD is just AWESOME.

Have you tried xHP? I can’t find mention of it here on 6post.

And does any BM3 users know if BM3 supports transmission tune for 650 N63? I seem to recall reading somewhere that it was only there for M6 S63?

I was reading on the X3 forum that BM3 had transmission tune for the X3 N55, (but that it disabled the steering wheel paddles), but great things about the xHP. Kind of thinking trying XHP on both.

[Frupal]

Originally Posted by Dutt1113

I am looking into purchasing a 2017 650 GC in the spring and was looking into performance modding it with an exhaust, tune, intake and lowering springs. I was thinking stage 1 tune from maybe bootmod3, DME, RK, etc. Then i got to thinking Catless DP's which are cheap even for good ones (~$500) and going stage 2 tune for a little more power, but mostly for sound. For exhaust i wanted to keep the valves so go with m6 comp mufflers and then add the catless DP's. Would that be too loud or drone? I wanted to get to m6ish power levels without getting an m6 which will not only cost more, but there's things i don't like about the M6. First, it has RWD and would not be good for Michigan weather. Second, it doesn't have the nice digital cluster like 650 does and it lacks ACC which is nice for highway driving. For stage 1/2, would a new intercooler or better/more durable charge pipe be needed?

Had a friend who gave me the best advice I never asked for: “Factory is the hot setup, Robin (me). If you want a car with more horsepower, buy one that comes from the factory that way.”

[AccordTR]

Originally Posted by Frupal

Had a friend who gave me the best advice I never asked for: "Factory is the hot setup, Robin (me). If you want a car with more horsepower, buy one that comes from the factory that way."

What lol? The N63TU is majorly detuned from factory to meet emissions and insurance rates. You can easily gain 150-200 hp from it for about $5k. Your friend is clearly not a mod guy.