BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
      04-23-2021, 03:26 PM   #1
chassis
Major
chassis's Avatar
United_States
1248
Rep
1,116
Posts

Drives: BMW G01 X3, M-B GLE350W4
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Indiana

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
PSA test false positive rate 70%?

For the guys, but ladies chime in if you like.

The linked article (no sources, but hosted on a medical group's website) suggests 70% false positivity rate for the PSA test. Really? How can a test be offered with such a high false positive rate. If the article is true.

I googled a bit and found many examples talking about whether doing a PSA test is, or isn't, the best choice for the patient. I haven't found an NIH or FDA document that quantifies the false positivity rate.

What is everyone's view on the high false positivity rate claimed for the PSA test? Thanks.

https://www.ncfmg.com/wp-content/upl...-screening.pdf

Last edited by chassis; 04-23-2021 at 08:27 PM..
Appreciate 0
      04-28-2021, 05:36 PM   #2
Humdizzle
Lieutenant Colonel
2147
Rep
1,826
Posts

Drives: 2010 ferrari 458
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Missouri

iTrader: (0)

i see it sometimes with my patients. high psa on labs, i send them to urology, they come back saying everything was normal. there are other things that raise psa like prostatis (this is usually found in people who sit all day like truck drivers, or cyclists since the seat presses on the area). some people just live at a high level and nothing is wrong

we used to do psa screenings for everyone over 45-50. But now they've relaxed the rules and to only order it when someone has a high suspicion of prostate problems. probably due to the high false positivity rates and subsequent complications like the article mentions.

in short the test is a bit of a crapshoot. but if there is strong suspicion or risk of prostate cancer in the individual it can be helpful

another thing some urologists will tell you is that the number isn't as important as the trend or PSA velocity. a sudden uptick in your PSA number could mean cancer.
__________________

@Dr.Humdizzle
2018 Porsche GT3 6MT
2015 Silverstone F80 6MT
Previous: Ferrari 458 | E36 M3 | E46 M3 | R35 GTR
Appreciate 3
UPSROD555.00
chassis1248.00
M_Six5864.50

      04-28-2021, 06:00 PM   #3
JJ 911SC
Retired Navy Chief
JJ 911SC's Avatar
Canada
1277
Rep
497
Posts

Drives: BMW X3 M40i, 911SC
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Ottawa

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Key words...

Quote:
Originally Posted by chassis View Post
... The linked article (no sources, but hosted on a medical group's website)...
I also heard that the Covid Vaccine has a chip in it to modify your DNA

All jokes asside, here is the best recommendation from https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/heal...ing-guidelines


An Abnormal PSA Test: What Comes Next?

If your PSA score is in the abnormal range, your doctor may recommend you repeat the PSA test. If your levels are still high, your doctor might recommend one of the newer prostate cancer screening tests available today.

These tests can help better assess your risk for prostate cancer and determine whether a biopsy is necessary. Only a prostate biopsy can definitively diagnose prostate cancer.
Appreciate 2
UPSROD555.00
chassis1248.00

      04-28-2021, 07:58 PM   #4
Glen e
Private
United_States
69
Rep
97
Posts

Drives: 21 X2 m35i
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: Fort Lauderdale

iTrader: (0)

I’ve been getting a PSA for the last eight years, I’m 70. My Doc is always looking for one thing and that is a radical change in the number that I usually generate. So far it has been smooth sailing with a PSA registering always about 1.5 to 1.7.
__________________
Glen
Ft Lauderdale
2021 X2M35i
Appreciate 1
chassis1248.00

      04-29-2021, 09:29 AM   #5
M_Six
Free Thinker
M_Six's Avatar
United_States
5865
Rep
6,843
Posts

Drives: 2016 MB GLC300 4matic
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Foothills of Mt Level

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Humdizzle View Post

another thing some urologists will tell you is that the number isn't as important as the trend or PSA velocity. a sudden uptick in your PSA number could mean cancer.
Exactly what my doctor has been telling me. Establish a baseline, then see if it changes. My results have been virtually identical (and very low) for years, so I'm ok with that. And I cycle 100 miles/week. Seems to have no effect in that regard for me.
__________________
Mark
markj.pics

"There is no shame in dropping fruit in your glass."
-UncleWede
Appreciate 2
chassis1248.00
Humdizzle2146.50

      04-29-2021, 05:40 PM   #6
UPSROD
Lieutenant Colonel
555
Rep
1,510
Posts

Drives: 2013 E92 M3
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Richland, Wa.

iTrader: (2)

Garage List
2013 BMW M3  [5.00]
Everyone is correct, it is a tool to predict the chance of prostate cancer not to say that you have it, a biopsy is required to do that.
Appreciate 2
JJ 911SC1277.00
chassis1248.00

      05-03-2021, 09:02 PM   #7
chassis
Major
chassis's Avatar
United_States
1248
Rep
1,116
Posts

Drives: BMW G01 X3, M-B GLE350W4
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Indiana

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Thanks for the comments. It found it surprising that a commonly recommended test (the PSA test) has such a high incidence of false positive results. Something to consider when weighing the decision whether or not to get the test.

Last edited by chassis; 06-03-2021 at 09:03 AM..
Appreciate 0
      05-03-2021, 09:18 PM   #8
erawamai
Second Lieutenant
erawamai's Avatar
Australia
79
Rep
204
Posts

Drives: BMW 330i G20
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Sydney, Australia

iTrader: (0)

My dad (who is 73) just got a higher than usual PSA result.

He typically sits at 4.5 and has been for many years and over the last year it increased to 7.4, which is a bit alarming especially regarding the change. Hopefully its one of those 'false positives' the article talks about.

Hopefully its just prostatitis and nothing insidious. My grandfather had prostatitis so it runs in the family.

He goes back for another blood test in a few weeks. If it's still high I suspect he will be sent to a urologist for further tests.
Appreciate 0
      05-15-2021, 07:48 PM   #9
JJ 911SC
Retired Navy Chief
JJ 911SC's Avatar
Canada
1277
Rep
497
Posts

Drives: BMW X3 M40i, 911SC
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Ottawa

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Oh Oh...
Attached Images
 
Appreciate 1
upstatedoc5347.00

      06-02-2021, 09:31 PM   #10
cooolone2
Lieutenant
cooolone2's Avatar
294
Rep
401
Posts

Drives: 20' M240iX B58, 01' 330XI E46
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: NY, USA

iTrader: (0)

PSA used alone is not a good predictor of Prostate Cancer. As noted there are many causations that can lend to elevated PSA results such as an infection, sexual activity, exercise (bike riding), etc... and age as well! A PSA reading in the 7's might not necessarily be too alarming depending upon personal history.

PSA is a gateway indicator to a possible need for further investigation, testing to determine the underlying cause of elevation. There are non-invasive liquid biopsies today that lend accurate diagnosis. And baseline imaging with MRI's that would and could better reveal if there is an issue. Usually there will be some symptoms present if in fact and elevated PSA might be associated with PCa off the bat. The DRE (digital rectal exam) might expose any abnormalities (lumps) during a physical exam, BPH, urinary, sexual and other dysfunction that would cause suspicion.

But elevated PSA alone... Means nothing!

Good luck and best regards!
Appreciate 1
chassis1248.00

      06-03-2021, 12:34 PM   #11
upstatedoc
I'll get back to you
upstatedoc's Avatar
5347
Rep
2,101
Posts

Drives: blue streak
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: not downstate

iTrader: (2)

I still check a yearly PSA on my pts over 50. Personally, Ive caught more cancers than pts have had adverse reactions to further testing. Of course this is anecdotal. Maybe other providers have have seen more bad outcomes to further testing?
__________________
2018 Stinger GT
1997 Toyota T100
2009 E90 N51 /Active Autowerke Stage 2 tune/BMW Performance Exhaust/
Countermeasure enthusiast.
Appreciate 1
chassis1248.00

      06-03-2021, 10:43 PM   #12
zx10guy
Colonel
3246
Rep
2,785
Posts

Drives: 2013 135i
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: DC

iTrader: (0)

This is all too familiar with a tumor marker test I have been going through for the past almost 8 years. CEA. I hate this blasted test as it creates so much anxiety in cancer patients. I get why it's used and the results from this test solely isn't a prognosticator for cancer. But there are so many things that affect this test and even if you have a low CEA number doesn't mean you're cancer free. I've been dealing with 4 years of extremely elevated CEA numbers and no one can tell me what is going on. My oncologist says I'm case study worthy as I've gone through all manners of testing: MRI, PET/CT, CT w/contrast, upper GI endoscopy, small bowel capsule endoscopy, and colonoscopy. All clear.

Seems I have to look forward to another potential paper chase with PSA testing whenever I get ordered to start getting tested.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lups View Post
We might not be in an agreement on Trump, but I'll be the first penis chaser here to say I'll rather take it up in the ass than to argue with you on this.
Appreciate 1
chassis1248.00

      06-04-2021, 09:15 AM   #13
zx10guy
Colonel
3246
Rep
2,785
Posts

Drives: 2013 135i
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: DC

iTrader: (0)

Something else I wanted to add. There has been other blood tests that have been created to get around the older tumor marker testing methodologies. The two companies that have created the newer tests are Signatera and Natera. They're both DNA based tests that look for tumor DNA floating in your blood. From what I've been told, they're much more accurate than the old tumor marker tests particularly CEA.

I wonder if something similar could be done for PSA.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lups View Post
We might not be in an agreement on Trump, but I'll be the first penis chaser here to say I'll rather take it up in the ass than to argue with you on this.
Appreciate 1
chassis1248.00

Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:56 AM.




6post.com
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST