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      01-22-2021, 05:26 PM   #89
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That headline image car color, whichever that is, I really dig. My taste for some reason really has gone from silvers and blues into browns and burgundy/dark reds and its not like im 50! Just nice and classy, art deco car colors Im really into now. Nice to see BMW still offering something other than basic greys. May be in 20s we will see revival of these cool century old colors back on cars, ivory, yellows, burgundy, blues and greens.
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      01-22-2021, 10:23 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stein_325i View Post
Great post. One point I always make about the new "M-Performance" cars is that its simply all marketing. The M340i is nothing but a 340i that comes with the M-Sport package standard, and uses the M badge to compete with the C43 and S4 which also have used their brand's cache. That's not to say these aren't great cars, because they are (well... maybe not the X2 or 2GC which should stay far away from M badges) but cars like the M635i were actually modified greatly compared to their regular counterparts. Aside from a cooling package, the M340i features many of the same options and equipment as the 330i when fully equipped and drive very similarly, just with different powertrains, which has how it always was, before the M badge made its way on the back of the car. I've driven a 330i and M340i both fully optioned and other than the powertrain and steering (30i actually gets the newer and better rack) they do not feel different.
I may be biased but in the case of the M340i, I wouldn't consider it a 340i with an M badge. Where the previous version was hard to recommend over the 330i and didn't come close to the M3, the M340i has a LSD and with the tech pack comes upgraded cooling and brakes. As the term Mperformance suggests it is a more performance oriented version and therefore BMW categorises these variants differently as they have always done... nothing new here.

The biggest issue therefore is perhaps not how BMW classifies it performance oriented vehicles but more likely that 'true M' owner snobbery comes into play here as both M and Mperformance versions are classified and reported as one in BMW terms.
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      01-24-2021, 11:36 AM   #91
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https://www.bmwusa.com/vehicles/m-models.html

weird how they don't have any Mxxx cars on this page
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      01-24-2021, 03:18 PM   #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by six75LT View Post
https://www.bmwusa.com/vehicles/m-models.html

weird how they don't have any Mxxx cars on this page
It’s not too surprising BMW NA still promotes them separately. We only get the very top layers of BMW’s range, so there aren’t nearly as many sub-M trim levels as there are in most other parts of the world.

On the global site, all tiers of M products are listed under “M”:

https://www.bmw.com/en/bmw-models.html
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      01-24-2021, 07:34 PM   #93
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I don't think there's anywhere in the world the situation to care more about a badge than in US
Totally different culture in Europe! You can see an M Sport 330d, an M340d and an M3 one next to the other, no badges on the trunk and either person totally happy with his choice!
What BMW reports is one thing put together by the Marketing Dept, what makes you happy to drive is the effort done initially by a Technical Dept.
What can be wrong here to get that mad?! 😁
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      01-25-2021, 12:21 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by SoManyBlueCars View Post
I totally get where you're coming from. BUT..

The M community wants each new generation to be faster than the last. We can all agree on that.

The F chassis cars were at the limit of control with 2-wheel drive when it came to launching. We can agree on that hopefully?

Therefore, all-wheel drive was inevitable. Hand-to-god, the F90 is the best overall M car I've ever driven, and that breaks just about my every classic M rule.
I agree on the AWD part. The F90 isn’t really launchable in RWD mode. Hell, it’ll spin up the Pirellis on a roll in 3rd gear in a straight line if it’s cold. Plus the AWD system is really good.

I guess I don’t fit their paradigm, but I want it all and still want it with a manual. I could’ve dealt with the new nose on the M3 and “downgraded”, but not when the manual means no AWD and no Competition pack and no one can seem to develop remote start with 3 pedals. AWD manual with any sports orientation at all is down to what Subaru?
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      01-25-2021, 08:19 AM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by italiabrain View Post
I agree on the AWD part. The F90 isn’t really launchable in RWD mode. Hell, it’ll spin up the Pirellis on a roll in 3rd gear in a straight line if it’s cold. Plus the AWD system is really good.

I guess I don’t fit their paradigm, but I want it all and still want it with a manual. I could’ve dealt with the new nose on the M3 and “downgraded”, but not when the manual means no AWD and no Competition pack and no one can seem to develop remote start with 3 pedals. AWD manual with any sports orientation at all is down to what Subaru?
Agree. But then the take rate for manuals will be lower, giving BMW a chance to say "the take rate is lower. So we're not making them anymore"

For AWD and a stick, I'm afraid you'd have to go back in time.
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      01-25-2021, 08:22 AM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vladberca View Post
I don't think there's anywhere in the world the situation to care more about a badge than in US
Totally different culture in Europe! You can see an M Sport 330d, an M340d and an M3 one next to the other, no badges on the trunk and either person totally happy with his choice!
What BMW reports is one thing put together by the Marketing Dept, what makes you happy to drive is the effort done initially by a Technical Dept.
What can be wrong here to get that mad?! 😁
You're saying people go to the trouble of debadging their "M" because they don't care about the badge? If they go to the trouble to remove the badge they are thinking about it also.
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      01-25-2021, 10:33 PM   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vladberca View Post
Totally different culture in Europe! You can see an M Sport 330d, an M340d and an M3 one next to the other, no badges on the trunk and either person totally happy with his choice!
Quote:
Originally Posted by David70 View Post
You're saying people go to the trouble of debadging their "M" because they don't care about the badge? If they go to the trouble to remove the badge they are thinking about it also.
There can be tax implications to badges ...
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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
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      01-27-2021, 12:20 AM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David70 View Post
You're saying people go to the trouble of debadging their "M" because they don't care about the badge? If they go to the trouble to remove the badge they are thinking about it also.
You can order them without a badge in Europe...
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      01-27-2021, 09:59 AM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ikester19 View Post
I may be biased but in the case of the M340i, I wouldn't consider it a 340i with an M badge. Where the previous version was hard to recommend over the 330i and didn't come close to the M3, the M340i has a LSD and with the tech pack comes upgraded cooling and brakes. As the term Mperformance suggests it is a more performance oriented version and therefore BMW categorises these variants differently as they have always done... nothing new here.

The biggest issue therefore is perhaps not how BMW classifies it performance oriented vehicles but more likely that 'true M' owner snobbery comes into play here as both M and Mperformance versions are classified and reported as one in BMW terms.
The F30 340i had the option of an LSD and upgraded cooling and brakes as well (which mine has). It didn't come close to an M3, but to say it was hard to recommend over a 330i is pure nonsense.

I wholeheartedly agree they should not count as M cars, they simply aren't
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Last edited by blue dragon; 01-27-2021 at 10:22 AM..
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      01-27-2021, 07:51 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blue dragon View Post
The F30 340i had the option of an LSD and upgraded cooling and brakes as well (which mine has). It didn't come close to an M3, but to say it was hard to recommend over a 330i is pure nonsense.
There is a world of difference between the F30 340i and G20 M340i which I won't get into.

Whilst we all know the Mperformance lineup is not true M, BMW classify them as one (as they have always done) since they are both performance oriented.
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      01-28-2021, 07:57 AM   #101
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Ridiculous marketing gimmick, with the influx of fake AMG drivers on the road with 43s etc, BMW felt the need to catch-up and make every 40i/50i model an M, I love options so don't get me wrong, but this is diluting the brand tremendously when a FWD based 235 can be considered a M car next to the M5 CS lol...

At least Audi separates it between S and RS, BMW and AMG are doing nothing for their high performance and enthusiast customer base
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