Strange issue (Manual Transmission)

[pokrovsky]

I know that there aren't many of us here but perhaps someone has some ideas.
my F06 developed strange behavior, first I started to get warnings on the dash saying the Auto Start/Stop is malfunctioning. It would come and go and recently started to do it pretty persistently, but also, not sure if it's related (if so I really don't understand how that can be?) hill hold assist seems to not work anymore.
While auto start/stop is an annoyance as it's pretty pointless feature especially on a manual transmission car, hill assist is a handy feature

Any troubleshooting clues anyone?

Thank you!

[rotomoto712]

Wow. So I just went to check, and I didn't even realize that my manual had auto start/stop! It was set to off, and unlike modern BMWs, it must remember the last setting. Anyways, if you have access to ISTA or similar, I would run a scan and do diagnostics on the system. I don't think hill assist is related, but I am far from an expert on that.

[pokrovsky]

Originally Posted by rotomoto712

Wow. So I just went to check, and I didn't even realize that my manual had auto start/stop! It was set to off, and unlike modern BMWs, it must remember the last setting. Anyways, if you have access to ISTA or similar, I would run a scan and do diagnostics on the system. I don't think hill assist is related, but I am far from an expert on that.

Thanks, I do have a cable but it's been a while since I messed with BMW programming. I used to tweak my e90 335i all the time but leave this unicorn mostly alone

[JDMSteven]

I believe you'll have an auxiliary battery under the trunk panel and when they get weak the auto stop start system can have issues.

[pokrovsky]

Originally Posted by JDMSteven

I believe you'll have an auxiliary battery under the trunk panel and when they get weak the auto stop start system can have issues.

thank you!

[pokrovsky]

Nope. No aux battery in my trunk

[pokrovsky]

Just a follow up. It is not a battery issue. I replaced the battery as the original one was getting tired and showed 19% life on the BMW diagnostic tool at the dealer. Got the brand new OEM one and properly coded/registered.
The Auto start/stop malfunction didn't go away neither hill assist and then it dawned on me that I only see the issue of hill assist not working when this auto start stop warning comes up and it does work when there is no error. It must be related to some sort of a clutch pedal switch/sensor!!! I have not dug there and wanted to ask people here.
It makes tons of sense to be related in this case as failing sensor/switch will deem auto start and hill hold inoperable, right?!?!
Anybody has a service manual that indicates that part by any chance?

[pokrovsky]

Just wantesd to follow up on the topic. Got some other tech diagnose the auto start stop issue and now they are telling me it is a neutral gear position swith of my manual tranny that is bad. It is located on top of the transmission and "the book" calls for transmission removal and hence obscene labor charge to get it replaces. Anybody experienced anything like this before?
There is no ill effects on driving just an annoying warning everytime I shut the car off telling me the auto start / stop function malfunction but I do want to properly address it.
Perhaps the subframe can be loosened that will allow access to the top of the transmission?

[pokrovsky]

Another follow up that hopefully help somebody in the future.
Yes, the neutral position sensor that sits on top of the transmission was the culprit.
Got it replaced and all good now.
As much as I’m angry about this not so optimum design at the stupid hall sensor sitting in a such inaccessible place that requires dropping the tranny, I can understand that perhaps there was no other option for the engineers to position it elsewhere.
Anyway. $100 part that required a lot of labor solved the issue.

[M6-Coupe]

Originally Posted by pokrovsky

I know that there aren't many of us here but perhaps someone has some ideas.
my F06 developed strange behavior, first I started to get warnings on the dash saying the Auto Start/Stop is malfunctioning. It would come and go and recently started to do it pretty persistently, but also, not sure if it's related (if so I really don't understand how that can be?) hill hold assist seems to not work anymore.
While auto start/stop is an annoyance as it's pretty pointless feature especially on a manual transmission car, hill assist is a handy feature

Any troubleshooting clues anyone?

Thank you!

I have completely different question and appreciate if you can chime in.
I see you are driving Manual F06 M6. I used to have F13 M6 with DCT. It was fantastic car anyways. I always thought about MT on a big heavy M6. Can you please let me know about your experience? I believe it's fun to drive.
I had MT on M3 and M4 but not on M6.

[pokrovsky]

Originally Posted by M6-Coupe

I have completely different question and appreciate if you can chime in.
I see you are driving Manual F06 M6. I used to have F13 M6 with DCT. It was fantastic car anyways. I always thought about MT on a big heavy M6. Can you please let me know about your experience? I believe it's fun to drive.
I had MT on M3 and M4 but not on M6.

This is the best combination of creature comfort, luxury and performance in my opinion. I’ve been on a hunt for this car for a couple of years and finally was able to find it 3 years ago and bought it on bring a trailer and imported it from Canada.
It is not an M3/4 by any means but it is in a different league quality built wise.
You can drive it like a 7 series and have fun nearly like with a smaller sports car. It doesn’t feel heavy at all. It feels so planted and even though it’s not as nimble as M3/4 it feels phenomenally sporty but super comfy.
These are the last German big V8 with a stick, totally extinct breed and I’ll keep it forever.
Appearance and lines are timeless and I don’t think it will look obsolete for many more years.

[M6-Coupe]

Originally Posted by pokrovsky

This is the best combination of creature comfort, luxury and performance in my opinion. I’ve been on a hunt for this car for a couple of years and finally was able to find it 3 years ago and bought it on bring a trailer and imported it from Canada.
It is not an M3/4 by any means but it is in a different league quality built wise.
You can drive it like a 7 series and have fun nearly like with a smaller sports car. It doesn’t feel heavy at all. It feels so planted and even though it’s not as nimble as M3/4 it feels phenomenally sporty but super comfy.
These are the last German big V8 with a stick, totally extinct breed and I’ll keep it forever.
Appearance and lines are timeless and I don’t think it will look obsolete for many more years.

Yes I agree about all you said about M6.
I also had very similar experience.
My question however is more about Manual Transmission on this car.
Dont you feel MT is kind of weak to handle this much power and torque?
With DCT I recall fishtailing even at gear 3 to gear 4 when I changed the gear close to redline.
DCT was too jerky in Sport+/S3.
All together was really fun but kind of scary in MDM and specially DSC OFF mode ☺️
This kind of behavior is most likely because of large amount of torque on rear axle due to gear ratios. I believe MT on M6 has much less aggressive ratios.

[M6-Coupe]

Some pictures of my beloved M6

[thebmw]

OP, as a fellow 6-spd M6 owner, thank you for your post and updates. I have found that these low volume cars do have some quality control issues surrounding their manual transmission parts. I have had my clutch hose rupture for no reason, even though the car has low miles. This disabled the car completely as the transmission could not be engaged. BMWNA offered no help.

I appreciate that BMW made these cars, but they obviously did not invest a single dollar to upgrade the components and make sure that the components were robust. I think they literally took off the shelf manual transmission parts.

[pokrovsky]

Originally Posted by thebmw

OP, as a fellow 6-spd M6 owner, thank you for your post and updates. I have found that these low volume cars do have some quality control issues surrounding their manual transmission parts. I have had my clutch hose rupture for no reason, even though the car has low miles. This disabled the car completely as the transmission could not be engaged. BMWNA offered no help.

I appreciate that BMW made these cars, but they obviously did not invest a single dollar to upgrade the components and make sure that the components were robust. I think they literally took off the shelf manual transmission parts.

You are correct to a certain extent. But it is hard to blame them for it. total volume of these rare beasts is minuscule. and the transmission is robust and pretty much identical to the M3/M4 units that are a bit more widely used.
It sucks that you had such a catastrophic failure but I'm sure driving this car and rowing gears and using your left foot still gives you plenty smiles every time.
There is nothing rational or practical or sane about these cars, so we just need to enjoy them for what they are

[pokrovsky]

Originally Posted by M6-Coupe

Yes I agree about all you said about M6.
I also had very similar experience.
My question however is more about Manual Transmission on this car.
Dont you feel MT is kind of weak to handle this much power and torque?
With DCT I recall fishtailing even at gear 3 to gear 4 when I changed the gear close to redline.
DCT was too jerky in Sport+/S3.
All together was really fun but kind of scary in MDM and specially DSC OFF mode ☺️
This kind of behavior is most likely because of large amount of torque on rear axle due to gear ratios. I believe MT on M6 has much less aggressive ratios.

Beautiful car, stunning color.
I have no experience driving the M6 with DCT (fortunately or unfortunately, who knows). I knew I wanted the 6 speed and never looked back.
Power is plentiful and you obviously can break tires loose practically with any and every shift, power and torque to the rear wheels is abundant. But that is again - exactly what I wanted, a classic rear wheel drive BMW just like they used to be
Gearing might be slightly different (I'm sure it is but I just don't know details) with the DCT. And obviously you can never recreate same combination of torque/speed output between the two. But I find the car very well mannered if you want it to be and playful enough when needed/wanted.
Honestly, I rarely put it in full M mode with MDM and DCS off but when I do I get full exhilaration out of it without being scared )

[pokrovsky]

View post on imgur.com

[M6-Coupe]

Originally Posted by pokrovsky

Beautiful car, stunning color.
I have no experience driving the M6 with DCT (fortunately or unfortunately, who knows). I knew I wanted the 6 speed and never looked back.
Power is plentiful and you obviously can break tires loose practically with any and every shift, power and torque to the rear wheels is abundant. But that is again - exactly what I wanted, a classic rear wheel drive BMW just like they used to be
Gearing might be slightly different (I'm sure it is but I just don't know details) with the DCT. And obviously you can never recreate same combination of torque/speed output between the two. But I find the car very well mannered if you want it to be and playful enough when needed/wanted.
Honestly, I rarely put it in full M mode with MDM and DCS off but when I do I get full exhilaration out of it without being scared )

DCT and MT have different gear ratios specially at first gear and that's why the proper launch at first gear with DCT was so hard. Lots of wheel spinning
DCT: 4.81/2.59/1.7/1.28/1/0.84/0.67
MT: 4.11/2.32/1.54/1.18/1/0.85

[M6-Coupe]

Originally Posted by pokrovsky

View post on imgur.com

Nice car nice color
One of the problem I had with M6 was brake squeaking/dust.
I see you have CCB so no squeak no dust?

[pokrovsky]

CCB is the best option I have on this car
And factory frozen grey color too of course

plenty of squealing but zero dust

[M6-Coupe]

Originally Posted by pokrovsky

CCB is the best option I have on this car
And factory frozen grey color too of course

plenty of squealing but zero dust

Looks like squeaking is part of DNA of these big heavy cars 😊
I had squeaking on M6 but not on M3 and M4. However it came back on M8 again …
Its funny those days BMW had zero maintenance program on brakes and I had them replaced brake pads and rotors 3 times. Every time it was good for only couple thousands miles. Finally I gave up! I think that program ( for brakes) ended in 2017.