Quote:
Originally Posted by 2007 to 2016 M6 Cab
S65 is rear wheel drive, 6.0L biturbo V12... The 4matic biturbo 5.5L V8 S63 is quicker than the S65 even with less horse power and torque by virtue of the AMG 4matic ... It shaves off 0.5 sec just like all the new AMG 4matics such as the E63 4matic vs non 4matic with the same engines in normal or "S" perf trim when everything else is the same but AMG 4matic vs non 4matic. The S63 AMG 4matic is also 0.5 sec quicker than non 4matic (I have had both 4matic and non with the same spec 5.5L biturbo). Thus I can see and understand the argument why M cars should go X-Drive in the future from BMW
Likely S63 not faster than the new comp package in the M6 with 600 hp ... But does feel better in the corners IMHO after tracking both my 2015 S63 and 2016 M6 non comp package on the same track ... And was quicker zero to 60 than my 2016
It would not surprise me if the new comp pack M6 would be quicker as it is a lighter car as well than the S63 ... And 50 hp more than my current M6 set up ... And I have not personally experienced that M6 edition
Thanks for the video, I did look at it!
Have you personally tracked both ... I have in Vegas (all AMG's on 4 trips) and M cars in Montreal on 2 trips, plus my cars here in Victoria ... And Porsche 911s/panamera/chayenne in turbo, GTS/GT4 trims at Mosport
There is some neat tech on the current S63 4matic ... Many Utube videos re torque vectoring around corners that pulls the car through the corners and makes it feel much lighter!! ... The torque vectoring in the S63 4matic makes it a much more nimble car than the s65, my last S63 non 4matic and my current M6
With much respect have a look as well ... You may become sold on the tech and perhaps the change in philosophy BMW M series has been talking about!
Where is the stig when we need him 
With the utmost respect, You don't have to take my word for it, just look at the zero to 60 or 62 listed for the 2015 S63 AMG 4matic and 2014 to 2016 M6 coupes in Internet reviews even by the same sources ... Don't get me wrong ... I love both my M6 and S63 and each is different and has its own niche and I don't think Id trade either for a replacement other than its next generation
At these high Hp and torque figures ... Added weight, technology and all wheel drive play an important role to get power to the ground and the weight around a bend ... Something Porsche 911 GT4 and turbo's have learned over non all wheel drives!
Might I add viper, hellcats to the table as non all wheel drive examples re power/torque/mass and performance and feel
With much respect to you as I know you know your stuff based off you posts, all good discussion points by you, and I now add all wheel drive and torque vectoring technology to the future direction of over 500 hp performance from AMG already there, M-seris to come, Porsche has already made the leap before both Benz and soon to be BMW ... And yet miles ahead still is Lambo/Audi R8 and Ferrari ... See what happens with mopar, Ford and GM!
By the way I had edited my above post a little after you quoted me |
Well, after reading your posts again, I figured out by "quicker" you meant short distance drag races (ie 0-60) while I was referring to rolling and other stuff; however this video also proves that M6 GC reaches 100 /150/200/250 km/h faster than S63 AMG 4Matic.
According to the numbers of websites you reffered, I think I have discussed more than enough (with others and not you) BMW intentionally underrated S63tu engine on both M5/M6 and the 0-60 numbers on BMW website is not accurate. Many magazines including C&D and MT have tested M5/M6 and they can confirm these cars (M6 GC and M5) can go 0-60 in 3.7 second. For M5 you can watch the MT video
Here
or you can see the result of test for M6GC performed by C&D
Zero to 60 mph: 3.7 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 8.0 sec
Zero to 130 mph: 13.0 sec
Rolling start, 5-60 mph: 4.0 sec
Top gear, 30-50 mph: 2.1 sec
Top gear, 50-70 mph: 2.8 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 11.9 sec @ 124 mph
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...pe-test-review
Compare to 2015 S63 AMG Coupe 4Matic:
Zero to 60 mph: 3.7 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 8.5 sec
Zero to 130 mph: 14.2 sec
Zero to 160 mph: 23.9 sec
Rolling start, 5-60 mph: 4.3 sec
Top gear, 30-50 mph: 2.6 sec
Top gear, 50-70 mph: 2.8 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 12.0 sec @ 120 mph
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...pe-test-review
I don't see anywhere S63 is faster than M6. Furthermore, as apple to apple comparison, you have to compare the S63 Coupe with M6 coupe... I can't find data for M6 Coupe but since she is 100-150 lighter than both M5 and M6GC, I expect a little faster times.
We can keep arguing about 0-60 or 1/4 mile or many thing else but again to me a ~199" long 4750 lb luxury S63 coupe is not a sport car at all.
Also regarding to torque vectoring, BMW does not believe in torque vectoring and none of current M cars have torque vectoring and that's why we enjoy the kicking at gear shifting. Furthermore the latest release of MB C63S with all marketing tricks of torque vectoring is not faster than M4 GTS (with similar power and torque) or even stock M3/M4 (F8x).