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      01-07-2013, 05:56 PM   #1
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Hi everyone,

The 650i xDrive (F13 and F06) can hit 60mph in 4.4 seconds. That is only 0.1 seconds slower than the M5 and 0.2 slower than the F13 M6 and F06 M6, according to the international BMW website.

My question is: Are these two very close to the M5 and M6s' performance on the track?

If so, the M division should consider weight loss for the M5 and M6s, obviously. Everyone already knows that they are porkers.

P.S.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...k/viewall.html

~3.4 seconds from 0-60mph for the next E63 AMG. Watch out, M5.
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      01-07-2013, 07:08 PM   #2
southern6er22
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Comparing the 650xi and M6 is kinda apples and oranges. The M6 has so much performance tech to it that the 650xi lacks that they're really two different classes of vehicles, despite being very close cousins. The 650xi is not a crass American muscle car by any means, but it isn't quite at the same level as the M6. I remember reading something that said the M6 only shares 18% of its parts with the regular F12/13.

Undoubtably, weight loss would make a big difference in both models of the 6. CF on these cars is going to make them astonishing in 5 to 10 years' time.
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      01-08-2013, 02:26 AM   #3
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I think in order for BMW to compete with MB , Audi and Porsche they need to have their ///M cars equipped with XDrive or they will be left out if the performance race.
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      01-08-2013, 09:01 AM   #4
motorsport_cat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WhyGeeGee
I think in order for BMW to compete with MB , Audi and Porsche they need to have their ///M cars equipped with XDrive or they will be left out if the performance race.
I'm thinking they should too. It's against the "M Genes", but they can modify the xDrive system for the torque split, just like AMG is doing now with 4Matic. Also, I believe that M already did that with the X5 M and X6 M so they know it's very possible.
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      01-09-2013, 12:07 AM   #5
BMWMilan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motorsport_cat View Post
Hi everyone,

The 650i xDrive (F13 and F06) can hit 60mph in 4.4 seconds. That is only 0.1 seconds slower than the M5 and 0.2 slower than the F13 M6 and F06 M6, according to the international BMW website.

My question is: Are these two very close to the M5 and M6s' performance on the track?

If so, the M division should consider weight loss for the M5 and M6s, obviously. Everyone already knows that they are porkers.

P.S.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...k/viewall.html

~3.4 seconds from 0-60mph for the next E63 AMG. Watch out, M5.
Judging a car based on just 0-60 numbers is sort of like judging a woman based purely on her breast size. There is more - much more, in fact - to a car's performance than just straight line speed from a standstill.

The man who picks a car based on 0-60 is the same man who chooses a wife based on cup size.
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      01-09-2013, 08:20 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ipsedixit View Post
Judging a car based on just 0-60 numbers is sort of like judging a woman based purely on her breast size. There is more - much more, in fact - to a car's performance than just straight line speed from a standstill.

The man who picks a car based on 0-60 is the same man who chooses a wife based on cup size.
Ahh, but you are asuming the the E63 isn't the complete package. Unfortunately for the M5, it probably will be.

I would pick a fully Dinan modded 650xi over an M6; there's no point going through life not getting traction and spinning your wheels.
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      01-09-2013, 10:44 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ipsedixit
Quote:
Originally Posted by motorsport_cat View Post
Hi everyone,

The 650i xDrive (F13 and F06) can hit 60mph in 4.4 seconds. That is only 0.1 seconds slower than the M5 and 0.2 slower than the F13 M6 and F06 M6, according to the international BMW website.

My question is: Are these two very close to the M5 and M6s' performance on the track?

If so, the M division should consider weight loss for the M5 and M6s, obviously. Everyone already knows that they are porkers.

P.S.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...k/viewall.html

~3.4 seconds from 0-60mph for the next E63 AMG. Watch out, M5.
Judging a car based on just 0-60 numbers is sort of like judging a woman based purely on her breast size. There is more - much more, in fact - to a car's performance than just straight line speed from a standstill.

The man who picks a car based on 0-60 is the same man who chooses a wife based on cup size.
I am not judging the car by its 0-60 time. It's simply an example I provided to show that the E63 AMG will have more traction, thus giving it an advantage on the track. Check out the link I provided...
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      01-09-2013, 11:42 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motorsport_cat View Post
I am not judging the car by its 0-60 time. It's simply an example I provided to show that the E63 AMG will have more traction, thus giving it an advantage on the track. Check out the link I provided...
AWD may provide better traction, esp. from standstill, but AWD is not always superior vis-a-vis RWD on a track when it comes to performance.

There are so many factors that come into play when trying to squeeze the best possible performance out of a car, in terms of track times.

As with any system, AWD has advantages and disadvantages. The advantages you have already mentioned -- more traction, esp. from a standstill. The disadvantages are not as obvious. First, AWD are generally heavier than their RWD counterparts, which can negatively impact the balance of the car in terms of rear/front weight distribution. Second, AWD can result in understeer because the front wheels are still supplying power and trying to turn.

So, yes, there are advantages with AWD, but one cannot overlook the disadvantages.

While old, this is a pretty good and fair read of AWD v. RWD (and v. FWD). http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...e/viewall.html
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      01-10-2013, 03:00 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ipsedixit View Post
AWD may provide better traction, esp. from standstill, but AWD is not always superior vis-a-vis RWD on a track when it comes to performance.

There are so many factors that come into play when trying to squeeze the best possible performance out of a car, in terms of track times.

As with any system, AWD has advantages and disadvantages. The advantages you have already mentioned -- more traction, esp. from a standstill. The disadvantages are not as obvious. First, AWD are generally heavier than their RWD counterparts, which can negatively impact the balance of the car in terms of rear/front weight distribution. Second, AWD can result in understeer because the front wheels are still supplying power and trying to turn.

So, yes, there are advantages with AWD, but one cannot overlook the disadvantages.

While old, this is a pretty good and fair read of AWD v. RWD (and v. FWD). http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...e/viewall.html
What are you saying is true but I think these companies have come a long way now that the advantage of AWD outweights it's diadvantages.

A good example is the Nissan GT-R and Panamera Turbo S both of them have AWD and both cars handel better than any RWD.
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      01-10-2013, 10:36 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WhyGeeGee View Post
What are you saying is true but I think these companies have come a long way now that the advantage of AWD outweights it's diadvantages.

A good example is the Nissan GT-R and Panamera Turbo S both of them have AWD and both cars handel better than any RWD.
What about the GT3? And some would say the new Cayman S outhandles any car on the road (less than 200k).

Last edited by BMWMilan; 01-10-2013 at 11:33 AM.
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      01-18-2013, 09:24 AM   #11
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M6 is not a trackcar. So yes it needs AWD, especially on slippery roads (rain/snow/ice).
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      01-18-2013, 10:09 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Levi View Post
M6 is not a trackcar. So yes it needs AWD, especially on slippery roads (rain/snow/ice).
That's teh key to teh AWD v RWD debate I think. Which one is best depends entirely on what you're using it for.
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