The old Lexus IS-F is no quicker than a new BMW 340i

[bimmer456]

So I was watching a YouTube video about used luxury cars and the OP claimed many late model 2012 - 2014 luxury sports sedans could be had for under $15k and I thought his estimated values were a little low even with high mileage unless maybe they were very base model with no options. Anyway, to keep a long story short he was claiming the is350 does 0-60 in 4.8 seconds which I knew was total baloney and called him out on it showing him the Lexus website saying even the new ones do 0-60 in 5.6 and a TFL video showing they are even slower. And yes this is with the big engine. Anyway I research the isf which they stopped making in 2013 and according to car and driver it only does 0-60 in about 4.8 seconds making it no faster than a 340i despite the big v8 with over 400 horsepower. We've certainly come a long way in just a couple years and Lexus IS slow AF.

[ASAP]

It's not really fair to compare tech that is now 5+ years old.... in addition, Toyota currently has no performance turbo motor on the market... I am sure one will come soon and we will have a more fair comparison coming.

Here is another shock... a 2018 340i only makes 20 more hp than a 2007 335i... lol

You want another shock... the F80 M3 engine configuration is nearly technically identical to the BMW N54 from 2007... TT 3.0L I6 with Direct Injection...

[Uber Commuter]

The ISF came out in 2008 and didn't change much; so that is 10 year old tech. You want to make crazy comparisons; my 2014 328 diesel is as fast as a 1981 Ferrari 308...

[mkoesel]

Lexus' "F" branded performance products haven't been terribly competitive.

Now that they finally have a turbocharged V6 (debuting in the 2018 LS500), there is a bit more hope. That engine would make the IS much more relevant, but I suspect it won't happen until the next generation (around 2020). A potential IS-F could then use a higher output version. It's 3.5L rather than the 3.0L that many turbocharged V6 engines displace, so there is plenty of room to grow.

[mirob]

I remember, like it was yesterday, when the IS-F came out. They even had advertisements in movie theaters. At the time, Lexus claimed a 4.6 second 0-60mph time.

[bimmer456]

Originally Posted by ASAP

It's not really fair to compare tech that is now 5+ years old.... in addition, Toyota currently has no performance turbo motor on the market... I am sure one will come soon and we will have a more fair comparison coming.

Here is another shock... a 2018 340i only makes 20 more hp than a 2007 335i... lol

You want another shock... the F80 M3 engine configuration is nearly technically identical to the BMW N54 from 2007... TT 3.0L I6 with Direct Injection...

The B58 came out in 2016 so only 3 years after the ISF wen out of production. The same engine is in the GSF and all F models (which is like the M division for Lexus). The power has been upped slightly but otherwise same engine. I will say the exhaust note on the newer cars sounds great with a NA V8. GSF is only 4.4 0-60. The 340i xdrive with mppsk can hit that number.

[Mr Carrots]

Better to use 1/4 mile numbers as the AWD cars will usually own 0-60 contests.

Imo BMWs power bumps have been pathetic in the last decade but it's not entirely their fault that the 340i isnt 400 wheel HP by default, nonsensical increases in emissions and mpg requirements haven't helped.

[bimmer456]

Originally Posted by Mr Carrots

Better to use 1/4 mile numbers as the AWD cars will usually own 0-60 contests.

Imo BMWs power bumps have been pathetic in the last decade but it's not entirely their fault that the 340i isnt 400 wheel HP by default, nonsensical increases in emissions and mpg requirements haven't helped.

Lexus AWD cars are slower than RWD. The B58 has closer to 400 horsepower according to independent Dino tests showing wheel horsepower being slightly higher than bmw claims for flywheel.

[stooker]

Sooooo... to put it another way, current year BMW is faster than older Lexus... got it, thanks.

[insanecoder]

Originally Posted by bimmer456

So I was watching a YouTube video about used luxury cars and the OP claimed many late model 2012 - 2014 luxury sports sedans could be had for under $15k and I thought his estimated values were a little low even with high mileage unless maybe they were very base model with no options. Anyway, to keep a long story short he was claiming the is350 does 0-60 in 4.8 seconds which I knew was total baloney and called him out on it showing him the Lexus website saying even the new ones do 0-60 in 5.6 and a TFL video showing they are even slower. And yes this is with the big engine. Anyway I research the isf which they stopped making in 2013 and according to car and driver it only does 0-60 in about 4.8 seconds making it no faster than a 340i despite the big v8 with over 400 horsepower. We've certainly come a long way in just a couple years and Lexus IS slow AF.

I may be old school but I still recall 0-60 in under 5s being FAST
I know lots of cars are closer to 4 now but 5s is still fast enough for me.. thank God for the turbo

[Mr Carrots]

Originally Posted by bimmer456

Lexus AWD cars are slower than RWD. The B58 has closer to 400 horsepower according to independent Dino tests showing wheel horsepower being slightly higher than bmw claims for flywheel.

Er, no, you need a JB4 to get close to 400 whp and meth to go over that.

[kprocivic]

Originally Posted by Mr Carrots

Er, no, you need a JB4 to get close to 400 whp and meth to go over that.

Ehh well the n54 fresh off the shelves was making at least 300whp stock. They were underrated for sure.

[bimmer456]

Originally Posted by stooker

Sooooo... to put it another way, current year BMW is faster than older Lexus... got it, thanks.

Faster than current Lexus as well. 2018 Lexus IS 350 costs as much as 340i 0-60 5.6 seconds vs 0-60 4.8

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by kprocivic

Ehh well the n54 fresh off the shelves was making at least 300whp stock. They were underrated for sure.

More like 280 (with the "is" version typically getting over 290), while N55's were generally down about 10-15 to that. Since a B58 is a claimed 20hp advance over the N55, how would it magically gain 135 hp on the dyno?

[insanecoder]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

More like 280 (with the "is" version typically getting over 290), while N55's were generally down about 10-15 to that. Since a B58 is a claimed 20hp advance over the N55, how would it magically gain 135 hp on the dyno?

Half that can come off a tune .. did anyone do a 0-60 since slapping on an active 8 or JB4 I think most tuned 340s are hovering between 370-390HP?

[kprocivic]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

More like 280 (with the "is" version typically getting over 290), while N55's were generally down about 10-15 to that. Since a B58 is a claimed 20hp advance over the N55, how would it magically gain 135 hp on the dyno?

Um I'm talking whp, he's talking crank.

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by kprocivic

Um I'm talking whp, he's talking crank.

Either way, 400 crank is not even close for any non S series BMW sixer.

[tdott]

Yes, so what?

[kprocivic]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

Either way, 400 crank is not even close for any non S series BMW sixer.

I'll give you that. 400 is kinda high but 370 crank is pretty realistic.

[Mr Carrots]

Originally Posted by insanecoder

Half that can come off a tune .. did anyone do a 0-60 since slapping on an active 8 or JB4 I think most tuned 340s are hovering between 370-390HP?

The best I've seen was 3.2 from a stage 3 turbo with meth AWD, no launch control. Which is crazy fast off the line.

Drivability isn't there though, not until the ECU gets cracked.

But BMW -could- have made this a monster from stock if they'd wanted to, shit there are N54's pushing 600+ to the wheels, so really there's no excuse other than the need to make the M's more exclusive

[Anthony235]

You guys are missing an important piece of the puzzle in regards to the ISF comparison. The ISF weighed like 3900 pounds.

[SunnyD]

Would still rather have my old ISF over a 340 any day of the week.