Dyno numbers

kris1858 · 10-12-2015, 11:55 AM

Had my car dyno'd to see what she put to the wheel...
What do you think??
WHP: 567 hp
Torque: 532 lb-ft

N.S.A · 10-12-2015, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kris1858

Had my car dyno'd to see what she put to the wheel...
What do you think??
WHP: 567 hp
Torque: 534 lb-ft

Pretty good numbers that's like almost 700hp at the crank

lfelunden · 10-16-2015, 09:04 AM

How much did it put down before?
You could simply gain more power with a flash tune, but no doubt, nice reliable power.

devondragon · 10-16-2015, 09:23 AM

I haven't dyno'd my car yet (in the plans for this Fall), but the Turner dyno sheet for their tuning module shows 585 HP/525 ft-lbs. So little more HP, but little less TQ. Every dyno is different, and I figure the Turner module might be a little more aggressive than the Dinan (since they don't have the warranty to worry about). So yeah, I'd say that seems right. Assuming 15% drivetrain loss, that has you at ~670 HP at the crank, which isn't too shabby

C5driver · 10-16-2015, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by devondragon

I haven't dyno'd my car yet (in the plans for this Fall), but the Turner dyno sheet for their tuning module shows 585 HP/525 ft-lbs. So little more HP, but little less TQ. Every dyno is different, and I figure the Turner module might be a little more aggressive than the Dinan (since they don't have the warranty to worry about). So yeah, I'd say that seems right. Assuming 15% drivetrain loss, that has you at ~670 HP at the crank, which isn't too shabby

I've been eyeing this module for a while, so post results and your impressions when you're done!

M6-Coupe · 10-16-2015, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by N.S.A

Pretty good numbers that's like almost 700hp at the crank

Considering 12-15% drivetrain loss, Crank power would be 644-667 HP and Crank TQ would be 606-628 lb-ft ...

devondragon · 10-16-2015, 11:35 AM

C5driver - will do! The butt-dyno is impressed, and various methods of comparison (my favorite on-ramp, comparing speeds at various points on the track using the M Lap Timer app from before and after the module, etc... ) show noticeable increase in acceleration (once going fast enough to put the power down) (5-10 MPH faster). But my plan is to get up to Granite Dyno this Fall and get some real numbers. Will post here when I do!

N.S.A · 10-16-2015, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M6-Coupe

Quote:

Originally Posted by N.S.A

Pretty good numbers that's like almost 700hp at the crank

Considering 12-15% drivetrain loss, Crank power would be 644-667 HP and Crank TQ would be 606-628 lb-ft ...

Oh I see, thanks for doing the math. I just took a guess on the top of my head. Good numbers for the crank

PRican//M614 · 10-18-2015, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by N.S.A

Pretty good numbers that's like almost 700hp at the crank

Yes it izzzzz.....

BBLF13 · 10-21-2015, 02:31 AM

How do you convert whp to crank? any formula? Thanks

-Noob regarding dynos.

devondragon · 10-21-2015, 07:18 AM

Basically you just need to calculate drivetrain losses, which vary between types of drivetrains. I've always heard that BMW RWD has roughly a 15% loss.

CHP - (CHP * 0.15)= WHP

CHP * 0.85 = WHP

CHP = WHP/0.85

M6-Coupe · 10-21-2015, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by devondragon

Basically you just need to calculate drivetrain losses, which vary between types of drivetrains. I've always heard that BMW RWD has roughly a 15% loss.

CHP - (CHP * 0.15)= WHP

CHP * 0.85 = WHP

CHP = WHP/0.85

Well lets be realistic since today's car have a lot better drivetrian loss.
For RWD you can consider 12% and for AWD you can consider 15%

devondragon · 10-21-2015, 06:49 PM

M6-Coupe - not that I'm doubting you, but do you have any sources for that?

M6-Coupe · 10-21-2015, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by devondragon

M6-Coupe - not that I'm doubting you, but do you have any sources for that?

No I don't have any source and I doubt you can find any source, but I can tell you most of the drivetrain losses are happening at joints (such as Flywheel or Ring and pinion), transmission and differential. Today's high performance cars have much more efficient drivetrains than 10 years ago. For example DCT with two separated clutch is more efficient than a single clutch and that's why they even offer better fuel consumption. Why do you think ZF is claiming 20% better fuel economy? The same thing with differential and the other parts. On the other hand in case of M5, I have seen bunch of Dyno numbers claiming 520-540whp. Considering 15% drivetrain loss, the crank would be somewhere between 610-635 HP. I admit the power of S63tu is underrated by BMW but not this much. IND was one of the first one measured 527 whp. Considering 12-13% drivetrain loss, the crank would be ~600 HP and it makes sense to me...
You can read this article:
http://www.torquenews.com/106/2013-b...wer-advertised

devondragon · 10-21-2015, 09:18 PM

Interesting. This article - http://www.automobilemag.com/feature...rs4_dyno_test/ talks about 20% loss for AWD. I know RWD has more loss than FWD, so 15% makes some sense to me, but yeah it does mean the crank HP is pretty high. I could just be being optimistic hoping to have more power than I do though

I just found this - http://www.***********.com/showthrea...ion)-vs-Manual

which seems to state clearly that DCT has MORE loss than manual. Performance and fuel economy being gained by quicker shifts and higher gear ratios. I dunno.

Msizzle · 10-29-2015, 08:31 PM

one major flaw i find with drivetrain loss is the fact that we use a %. If each component robs X amount of hp, which is basically the power it takes to turn or move that component. Using a % infers that this loss would increase as power increases and that its not the case. If the car has a loss of about 75hp when it is stock and you then get a tune that adds 100bhp by using the same % you are saying the loss is now more than 75hp. Why would the amount of power needed to move the components increase just because the power increased?

devondragon · 10-30-2015, 12:07 AM

Well some of the loss points DO change based on how much power/torque is pushed through them, (added heat, more stresses, etc...). Actual losses will vary based on RPM, drivetrain load, component temperatures, etc... so it's really a ballpark range anyhow.

FWIW I've found several sources that show automatics typically show 2-5% higher loss than manuals, and RWD loss range from 10-18%.

10-12-2015, 11:55 AM	#1
kris1858 Lieutenant 555 Rep 417 Posts Drives: '23 BMW M8 Competition Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Aberdeen, MD iTrader: (0) Garage List 2016 BMW M6 [10.00]	Dyno numbers - Stage 2 Dinan + M Performance Exhaust Had my car dyno'd to see what she put to the wheel... What do you think?? WHP: 567 hp Torque: 532 lb-ft Attached Images __________________ Full Vorsteiner Aero Kit, ADV5.0 M.V2 CS rims, KW HAS kit, M Performance Exhaust w/ CF tips, CF Mirror Caps, CF Gear Selector Lever, CF Side Marker Gills, CF Front Grill, Dinan CF Intake, AFE CF Engine Cover, Stage II Dinan Tune, Exhaustmeister, Internal Escort 9500ci + Laser Shifters, Photosync window tint 65% windshield 35% windows, Full PPF xpel ultimate wrap, RK Autowerks noncatted DPs, reflector delete, various coding Last edited by kris1858; 10-20-2015 at 09:25 PM..
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10-16-2015, 09:04 AM	#3
lfelunden Banned 60 Rep 643 Posts Drives: BMW M5 F10 Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: German Autobahn iTrader: (0) Garage List 2013 BMW M5 [0.00] 2011 Alpina B3S Bit ... [9.50] 2010 Alpina B3 Biturbo [10.00] 2009 Alpina B5S [10.00]	How much did it put down before? You could simply gain more power with a flash tune, but no doubt, nice reliable power.
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10-16-2015, 09:23 AM	#4
devondragon Lieutenant 153 Rep 427 Posts Drives: 2019 M5 Competition Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Boulder, CO iTrader: (0) Garage List 2014 BMW M6 Coupe [8.50]	I haven't dyno'd my car yet (in the plans for this Fall), but the Turner dyno sheet for their tuning module shows 585 HP/525 ft-lbs. So little more HP, but little less TQ. Every dyno is different, and I figure the Turner module might be a little more aggressive than the Dinan (since they don't have the warranty to worry about). So yeah, I'd say that seems right. Assuming 15% drivetrain loss, that has you at ~670 HP at the crank, which isn't too shabby
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10-16-2015, 11:35 AM	#7
devondragon Lieutenant 153 Rep 427 Posts Drives: 2019 M5 Competition Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Boulder, CO iTrader: (0) Garage List 2014 BMW M6 Coupe [8.50]	C5driver - will do! The butt-dyno is impressed, and various methods of comparison (my favorite on-ramp, comparing speeds at various points on the track using the M Lap Timer app from before and after the module, etc... ) show noticeable increase in acceleration (once going fast enough to put the power down) (5-10 MPH faster). But my plan is to get up to Granite Dyno this Fall and get some real numbers. Will post here when I do!
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10-21-2015, 02:31 AM	#10
BBLF13 BMW Enthusiast 7 Rep 71 Posts Drives: 14' 650i Coupe Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: West Los Angeles, CA iTrader: (0)	How do you convert whp to crank? any formula? Thanks -Noob regarding dynos. __________________ 14' 650i Coupe. Alpine White M-Sport Package Dinan Stage 1 H&R Lowering Kit
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10-21-2015, 07:18 AM	#11
devondragon Lieutenant 153 Rep 427 Posts Drives: 2019 M5 Competition Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Boulder, CO iTrader: (0) Garage List 2014 BMW M6 Coupe [8.50]	Basically you just need to calculate drivetrain losses, which vary between types of drivetrains. I've always heard that BMW RWD has roughly a 15% loss. CHP - (CHP * 0.15)= WHP CHP * 0.85 = WHP CHP = WHP/0.85
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10-21-2015, 06:49 PM	#13
devondragon Lieutenant 153 Rep 427 Posts Drives: 2019 M5 Competition Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Boulder, CO iTrader: (0) Garage List 2014 BMW M6 Coupe [8.50]	M6-Coupe - not that I'm doubting you, but do you have any sources for that?
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10-21-2015, 09:18 PM	#15
devondragon Lieutenant 153 Rep 427 Posts Drives: 2019 M5 Competition Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Boulder, CO iTrader: (0) Garage List 2014 BMW M6 Coupe [8.50]	Interesting. This article - http://www.automobilemag.com/feature...rs4_dyno_test/ talks about 20% loss for AWD. I know RWD has more loss than FWD, so 15% makes some sense to me, but yeah it does mean the crank HP is pretty high. I could just be being optimistic hoping to have more power than I do though I just found this - http://www.***********.com/showthrea...ion)-vs-Manual which seems to state clearly that DCT has MORE loss than manual. Performance and fuel economy being gained by quicker shifts and higher gear ratios. I dunno.
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10-29-2015, 08:31 PM	#16
Msizzle Lieutenant 165 Rep 402 Posts Drives: 2013 M6 Coupe Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: Long Island, NY iTrader: (0)	one major flaw i find with drivetrain loss is the fact that we use a %. If each component robs X amount of hp, which is basically the power it takes to turn or move that component. Using a % infers that this loss would increase as power increases and that its not the case. If the car has a loss of about 75hp when it is stock and you then get a tune that adds 100bhp by using the same % you are saying the loss is now more than 75hp. Why would the amount of power needed to move the components increase just because the power increased?
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10-30-2015, 12:07 AM	#17
devondragon Lieutenant 153 Rep 427 Posts Drives: 2019 M5 Competition Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Boulder, CO iTrader: (0) Garage List 2014 BMW M6 Coupe [8.50]	Well some of the loss points DO change based on how much power/torque is pushed through them, (added heat, more stresses, etc...). Actual losses will vary based on RPM, drivetrain load, component temperatures, etc... so it's really a ballpark range anyhow. FWIW I've found several sources that show automatics typically show 2-5% higher loss than manuals, and RWD loss range from 10-18%.
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