Carbon Ceramic Breaks feedback

[terrainx]

If the squeak fits you must commit.... er.. if you are ok with a bit of the squeakies and the cost then by all means carbon are for you.

[shellbmb]

Originally Posted by Grayblack

I've had the steel brakes as well. The squeal from the CCB's are a lot worse. The bite is better on the CCB's once they're warm.

Looking at spec-ing an M6GC. Had steelies on my M5 and the brake noise was embarrassing. I was hoping they'd be somewhat less with CCB's. But they are worse? That's not what I wanted to hear.

[melvyn]

I retrofitted them on my M3, it was the best thing I done.The car handled a lot better at speed as well, I noticed the tyre pressure would always be 10 degrees higher than with the steel brakes as well offering more grip .
This car has them as well, they stop the car dead.Have had a couple of squeaks but a tap on the brake stops it.The car has now covered 9k miles and Idrive is saying 11k fronts and 15k rears, measured the rears and the pads are down to 7mill and fronts are down to 9.5 mill.Rears will get changed at 6 mill.

No dust whatsoever, would never have anothe M car without them as the difference is chalk and cheese.

[Grayblack]

Originally Posted by shellbmb

Looking at spec-ing an M6GC. Had steelies on my M5 and the brake noise was embarrassing. I was hoping they'd be somewhat less with CCB's. But they are worse? That's not what I wanted to hear.

CCB's definitely squeal more than the steel brakes. I guess it's the trade off of dust free wheels!

[E90Fleet]

Had a long discussion with 2 BMW Driving Instructors here a little while ago about CCB.

They run M3, M4, M5 and X6M at the school on the track.

Both said CCB's only feel like they have a little extra initial bite when warm but that they and the steels stop just as well on the track under heavy braking. ( M5 and M3)

The CCB's can handle a bit of extra heat before fading, but they say you are not looking after your brakes properly or having too much DTC intervention if the steels are getting too hot.

They also had to run more cool down laps with the CCB's to prevent the brake fluid boiling at the pits, as they retain more heat than the steels.


Currently BMW doesnt run CCB's for the track course anymore as they wear just as fast as steel on track, but cost WAY more to replace.

They also complained the CCB's were way more noisy when not on the track.

[speedracerlo]

If dust is the only concern, you should just upgrade your pads to Pagid or Hawks.
CCBs cost too much in my view unless you deck it out from factory. Money can be spent better elsewhere, but I guess different priorities for different people.
Like me.. I just bought two watches for around 10K... that's priority to me lol

[Phatcat]

Originally Posted by E90Fleet

Had a long discussion with 2 BMW Driving Instructors here a little while ago about CCB.

They run M3, M4, M5 and X6M at the school on the track.

Both said CCB's only feel like they have a little extra initial bite when warm but that they and the steels stop just as well on the track under heavy braking. ( M5 and M3)

The CCB's can handle a bit of extra heat before fading, but they say you are not looking after your brakes properly or having too much DTC intervention if the steels are getting too hot.

They also had to run more cool down laps with the CCB's to prevent the brake fluid boiling at the pits, as they retain more heat than the steels.


Currently BMW doesnt run CCB's for the track course anymore as they wear just as fast as steel on track, but cost WAY more to replace.

They also complained the CCB's were way more noisy when not on the track.

Lol, I asked my instructor in Korea BMW school and he said the same, that the CCBs doesn't really stop better than the steel version. He said it's a waste of money if you buying it for performance reasons.

But I have it on my M5 anyways because of the "coolness" factor and less brake dust. I originally wanted the Brembo GTR CCBs but they cost way more than factory BMW CCBs.

[melvyn]

Originally Posted by E90Fleet

Had a long discussion with 2 BMW Driving Instructors here a little while ago about CCB.

They run M3, M4, M5 and X6M at the school on the track.

Both said CCB's only feel like they have a little extra initial bite when warm but that they and the steels stop just as well on the track under heavy braking. ( M5 and M3)

The CCB's can handle a bit of extra heat before fading, but they say you are not looking after your brakes properly or having too much DTC intervention if the steels are getting too hot.

They also had to run more cool down laps with the CCB's to prevent the brake fluid boiling at the pits, as they retain more heat than the steels.


Currently BMW doesnt run CCB's for the track course anymore as they wear just as fast as steel on track, but cost WAY more to replace.

They also complained the CCB's were way more noisy when not on the track.

Originally Posted by Phatcat

Lol, I asked my instructor in Korea BMW school and he said the same, that the CCBs doesn't really stop better than the steel version. He said it's a waste of money if you buying it for performance reasons.

But I have it on my M5 anyways because of the "coolness" factor and less brake dust. I originally wanted the Brembo GTR CCBs but they cost way more than factory BMW CCBs.

Talking bullsh1t I am afraid.

Bigger discs , bigger pads equal more stopping power and less fade time after time.

Lots of people who track don't like these brakes because they are very expensive to maintain, they will out perform steel brakes in every dimension , but then you have to get out your wallet.If they were the same price as steels everyone would have them.

The composite that BM use hits full operating temps at 300c which is ideal for hard fast road use and only start to burn the composite at 600c which then becomes a prob on a short fast track .

[Phatcat]

Originally Posted by melvyn

Talking bullsh1t I am afraid.

Bigger discs , bigger pads equal more stopping power and less fade time after time.

Lots of people who track don't like these brakes because they are very expensive to maintain, they will out perform steel brakes in every dimension , but then you have to get out your wallet.If they were the same price as steels everyone would have them.

The composite that BM use hits full operating temps at 300c which is ideal for hard fast road use and only start to burn the composite at 600c which then becomes a prob on a short fast track .

Well, between the 3 BMW instructors at different countries, I don't see why they would lie.

Doesn't matter anyways, as I have CCB And this car is in Taiwan so I won't ever get to track it (only one decent track in Taiwan and it's small so I have no interest in going), the CCBs should last the entire duration in which I plan to own the car.

[melvyn]

Originally Posted by Phatcat

Well, between the 3 BMW instructors at different countries, I don't see why they would lie.

Doesn't matter anyways, as I have CCB And this car is in Taiwan so I won't ever get to track it (only one decent track in Taiwan and it's small so I have no interest in going), the CCBs should last the entire duration in which I plan to own the car.

Hi buddy,
I think you will find it's all about how much they cost for the extra benefits, hence the negative comments they receive.A semi pro track guy would destroy the discs and pads in just a couple of thousand miles, you have to pay to play at that level.The pads on mine are down to nearly 6 mill in 9k miles and I don't track the car .

[lfc3153]

And nobody's mentioned the 20kg unsprung weight saving lately!

[Phatcat]

Originally Posted by melvyn

Hi buddy,
I think you will find it's all about how much they cost for the extra benefits, hence the negative comments they receive.A semi pro track guy would destroy the discs and pads in just a couple of thousand miles, you have to pay to play at that level.The pads on mine are down to nearly 6 mill in 9k miles and I don't track the car .

Well, my instructor doesn't think CCB brakes all that much better than the steel version, hence he does't think it's worth it. Now did he provide numerical data to prove it? No, but he drives them day in and day out and I see no reason for him to tell me otherwise, not to mention another poster's two BMW driving instructor basically also saying the CCBs doesn't offer any significant braking advantage over the steel brakes.

If you insist the CCBs are better, I actually hope that's the case, it's cost me $17,000 USD to opt for it here in Taiwan, but even if it's not better, its fine, like I said before, I got it mainly for the gold calipers.

[CeeBoogie]

How long do the rotors last typically? I read that the CCB's are supposed to last maybe more than the lifetime of the car, but I know that all depends on how the car is driven... WHen you need pads do you have to get new rotors as well, or does it vary?

[melvyn]

Originally Posted by CeeBoogie

How long do the rotors last typically? I read that the CCB's are supposed to last maybe more than the lifetime of the car, but I know that all depends on how the car is driven... WHen you need pads do you have to get new rotors as well, or does it vary?

The rotors will last a long time if you look after them, damage to the composite occurs when they heat up over 600c so cool down is required.A hard brake from 150-70 mph will heat them over 400c.

You don't need new rotors when you need new pads, pads are recommended to be changed at around 50% or 6mill of pad remaining.Its a heavy car and will use the pads up quickly if driven hard, especially the rears.

[CeeBoogie]

That sounds like it's worth it to me, if you aren't going super fast all the time then the rotors can possibly last the entire life of the car? I know on my E46 M3 I was told that everytime I change pads I have to change the rotors as well. I was told that the rotors are soft core rotors, whatever that means so everytime I changed the pads I had to get new rotors as well.... Talk about a major pain......

[melvyn]

Originally Posted by CeeBoogie

That sounds like it's worth it to me, if you aren't going super fast all the time then the rotors can possibly last the entire life of the car? I know on my E46 M3 I was told that everytime I change pads I have to change the rotors as well. I was told that the rotors are soft core rotors, whatever that means so everytime I changed the pads I had to get new rotors as well.... Talk about a major pain......

You shouldn't have any probs with the rotors with fast road use as they will keep cooling down .
Can't comment on the E43 as never owned one, I do know that if you wanted the BMW sports pads for the E9x M3 or the F8x M3/4 they won't sell you them without new rotors in the UK.

Going back to the CCBs , I had them retrofitted to my F80 and found them to be excellent and the car felt totally different handling as well.I wouldn't have another M car without them

[RichardP]

I don't have a direct comparison with the steel disks, but the CCs are the best brakes I've ever had on a car. They handled a track day round Cadwell Park, which is pretty tight, with ease.

They do squeak badly sometimes, usually when manoeuvring at slow speed after washing the car, the noise goes after one or two stops from more than 10mph. They also squeak slightly most of the time, not enough to hear with the windows closed, but audible with them open.

As most have said, virtually no dust. You get more road dirt on your wheels than brake dust.

I've currently done nearly 37,000 miles. The front pads have 13mm of material when new, 9mm being usable, mine are down to 12mm. The rear pads have 12mm when new, 7mm being usable, mine are down to 10mm. So in 37,000 miles I've used 11% of the front pads and 28% of the rears. At those rates I should do over 100,000 miles on the rears and over 300,000 miles on the fronts! Disks are not showing any measurable wear.

[IM6]

I have CCB on my coupe. Been driving M4 with steel brakes and I am so used to the sharp biting power of CCBs that these steelies on M4, in comparison, feels like it has no brakes.

Nothing compares to CCB, amazing braking power. However the squeak is a nightmare.